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1

As always with the Blethen's "family owned" Seattle Times, they endorsed the guy who wants to repeal the state's only progressive tax -- the estate tax -- which the Blethens have been on a jihad to eliminate for years. Talk about a single-issue focus! The fact that Rossi would bust unions, crack down on reproductive choice, and pave the world is probably just icing on the cake to them.

Posted by Murgen | October 18, 2008 10:25 AM
2

Go Dino!

Posted by Mr. Poe | October 18, 2008 10:34 AM
3

This was easily the lamest endorsement I've ever read, but I guess that's fitting since it's been the lamest gubernatorial campaign I've ever witnessed. Does Chris Gregoire really want to be re-elected? I get no passion from her. And Rossi? Monotone. Flat. Being governor is about more than budgets and roads and NBA teams, Dino and the Seattle Times.

State government is so important and yet Washington just doesn't seem to give a damn about it. State politics were so much more fun in Pennsylvania and New York. Voting for Gregoire but without much enthusiasm or hope.

Posted by Suze | October 18, 2008 10:48 AM
4

Ugh.

Posted by Greg | October 18, 2008 10:53 AM
5

The Times endorsed him in 2004 too. Frank's an ass.

Posted by DOUG. | October 18, 2008 10:55 AM
6

If I am ever able to afford a newspaper subscription, it will be the P-I.

Posted by CP | October 18, 2008 10:59 AM
7

Almost as stupid as the P-I's Reichert endorsement.

Basically: We like Burner, Reichert disappointed us and here's why, vote for Reichert.

Posted by Mahtli69 | October 18, 2008 11:20 AM
8

Anyone who thinks tax cuts impoverish a country ought to look at what's been happening overseas.

Ireland cut its corporation tax rate from 38% in 1996 to 12.5% in 2002 and saw business tax revenues rise by 170% between 1996 and 2002. Ireland has enough cash on hand to guarantee all homeowners against bank failures, which they've done.

Australia reduced its corporation tax rate from 36% in 1998 to 30% in 2001. Business tax receipts rose by 116% between 1997 and 2004.

South Africa reduced its corporation tax rate from 35% in 1998 to 29% in 2004. Revenues rose by 259% between 1999 and 2004.

Other countries have not reduced business taxes and seen stagnating revenues:

The UK business tax rates remained at 30% between 2000 and 2005. In 1997 were 30.4 bn - in 2004 receipts had increased by 12% to 34.1.

The US has a 35% rate of Federal Tax plus State Tax (usually around 5%) making an overall corporate rate of about 40%. In 2000, revenues were $255 bn and had barely increased by 2004.

Japan has an effective rate of corporation tax that can reach 41%. It saw revenues fall from 18,720 bn in 2000 to 18,075 bn in 2004.

Just sayin'.

Posted by Seajay | October 18, 2008 11:34 AM
9

Oh well. Who needs socialist public transit funding anyways, right?

Posted by jessejb | October 18, 2008 11:40 AM
10

Dear MR. Seajay:
hey thanks for putting up facts and not just opinion, ranting, etc.

Here's a couple of questions and comments.

1. You['re taking a slice of time. Let's take a bigger slice of time, like all humanhistory. Tell us the nations with the highest per capita GDP-- what are the top fifty say?

Now line up the nations with the highest overall tax rates. Say, the top fifty.

I'd estimate that apart from a few havens like Licht. or petronations there are quite a few very high tax nations up there in top income per capita like all those socialist states in Europe etc.

Undermining your theory.


Meanwhile, low tax Guatemala, Pakistan and other places that's dont' even have a government often have crushing poverty.

Not that there's always a general rule or anything, too.

2. Didn't Ireland also join the EC? Does Ireland have national health care? Did the Irish government target tax breaks for economic development to selected industries and sectors, totally like messing with the free market, man? What's their policy on tuition subsidies, too?

3. "Australia reduced its corporation tax rate from 36% in 1998 to 30% in 2001" and you say that's a nice low tax rate spurring growth. But then you say UK business tax rates remained at 30%" making growth lag.

Explain.

4. Seems like your favorite example is Ireland. Is there some other nation that you can pick as a model? If so, do you agree that in addition to their tax rate we should adopt everything else they have there whether it's national health care, no national health care, basically free college tuition, no college tuition, whatever?

Or are you going o pick and choose?

Please. Tell us what nation's policies you like the best. Now. One nation.

thank you.

The Eurolover,

Posted by PC | October 18, 2008 12:10 PM
11

Mr. Poe is so gross. Log cabin republican.

Posted by jrrrl | October 18, 2008 12:25 PM
12

Rossi will re-defeat the Marxist lesbian Gregoire.

The Marxist lesbian Gregoire only "won" when thus operatives of the Democrat "found" (translation: invented) votes for her.

If there were such a thing as karma, it will bite Gregoire's fat ass on November 4th.

Posted by Lord Basil | October 18, 2008 12:32 PM
13

That "superpower" is called "cutting spending". And you too believe Rosi possesses it, at least more of it that Gregoire; that's precisely why you don't want him elected.

Posted by David Wright | October 18, 2008 12:44 PM
14

Another longish one skip it if you only like short and snappy posts.

From Wiki, on the Celtic Tiger:

"Many economists credit Ireland's growth to a low corporate taxation rate . . . and to net transfer payments from members of the European Union like Germany and France"

Sejay, that part is what yo'd call socialism? Taxing the rich nations to give to thee poor Ireland? Exactly whatyour man McCain is condemning right now on TV?

So you must admit that redistribution is a valuable took, since you cite Ireland. Go ahead. Admit it, you unicausalist liar.

to continue:

"that were as high as 4% of gross national product."

quite a lot of socialist transfers there. Goddy.

"Between 1997 and 2004, Charlie McCreevy, the Minister for Finance, pursued fiscal policies such as low taxation[3] and contributed to a dramatic reduction in public debt over the boom years.[4]"

Another point for socialistic commies like Clinton who REDUCED THE PUBLIC DEBT and another nail in the coffin of the wildly irrepsonsible fiscal policies of GWB and McCain.

Let's continue our "conversation, OK, Seajay?

"EU Aid The EU aid was used to increase investment in the education system and physical infrastructure."

Aha. Exactly what Obama wants to do. I guess this citing of Ireland means you support that part of Obama's program, eh?

"The increased productive capacity of the Irish economy is often attributed to these investments, which made Ireland more attractive to high-tech businessmen."

You see, some govt. spending is good for everyone. Glad you now implicitly admit this by citing Ireland. Because it adds to productivity of the private sector. See how simple the multicausal world is?

"Ireland's membership in the European Union since 1973 helped the country gain access to Europe's large markets."

Just as I suspected. AS noted before, this antitrade posturing of most Democrats is actually not so smart.

"Industrial Policies
In the 1990s, the provision of subsidies and investment capital by Irish state organisations (such as IDA Ireland) encouraged high-profile companies like Dell, Intel, and Microsoft to locate in Ireland."

Aha. Another example of state directed investment, a/k/a SOCIALISM resulting in higher growth rates and a better society.

Thank you for reading Seajay. Now you go do the research and I will predict you'll find Ireland has socialized health insurance and largely free/subsidized college tuition. So out of about 7-8 factors leading to higher growth, many or most are clearly what the USA Democrats favor:

social transfer payments
infrastructure and educ. investments
state directed investment
national health care
the article also mentions increased immigration -- I think in the EC you can work anywhere -- so this too means the USA Democrats policies (not so harsh on imigration) is the better in the exact example you cite.

OK, the conclusion is this:

You should now change from conservative to "socialist" and advocate for your lower tax rates but also infra and edcu investment, social transfer payemnts, etc. And this means you should donate and and work for and vote for Obama. Cuz he's for most of what you want, it seems.

Hey glad to have you join up!

And if you disagree, please continue the "conversation." 4% of DP in transfer payments. Wow.

Unity,

Posted by PC | October 18, 2008 12:48 PM
15

cancel my subscription!!!

Posted by SeMe | October 18, 2008 12:58 PM
16

The Seattle Times endorsed Presi-dunce George W over Nobel Prize winner Al Gore in 2000. Tells you something about their judgment.

Posted by RainMan | October 18, 2008 1:09 PM
17

The Blethens' endorsement of Rossi, while disappointing is not surprising.
I'm keeping my fingers crossed (and donating and lawn-signing) that Gregoire gets re-elected. However, the only silver lining on a Rossi win is that he will be so ineffectual as governor - the Legislature is surely going to remain overwhelmingly Democratic.
He won't be able to get bills though, correct? And, if he vetoes, he'll be overridden, correct? (Sorry, haven't read the State Constitution lately.)

Posted by Madashell | October 18, 2008 1:12 PM
18

@13: What part of an $18bn Transportation Plan constitutes a spending cut?

Posted by AJ | October 18, 2008 1:38 PM
19

Yes - Rossi will face a hostile legislature, and once his true colors come out (he's a reactionary wingnut), the Dems will increasingly force him to veto popular legislation and over-ride him on a regular basis. Or he'll do a flip-flop and become a populist so he can work with Democrats to pass legislation and get re-elected.

Any Democrat who votes Rossi to "spite" Gregoire or because she isn't liberal enough is a fucking moron. We're about to enter a near-Depression, and we need people who aren't afraid to re-jigger taxes and spend money in a progressive way. This state has a structural deficit in tax revenue, and electing a Republican will just make everything worse.

BTW - The Blethens couch their endorsements in flowery language but there's two things at the root of them: The estate tax is evil; Seattle/WA state should "think small". Fuck both of those (especially fuck the lesser seattle way of thinking). I can't wait until the Blethens go bankrupt and are forced to sell the papers to some out of state owners. At least they won't couch their corporate agenda in community supporting rhetoric.

Posted by jcricket | October 18, 2008 1:41 PM
20

People living inside Seattle, raise your hand if you think voting in Rossi will "stick it to you" as some (lots) seem to think.

Posted by AJ | October 18, 2008 2:11 PM
21

"Seems like your favorite example is Ireland. Is there some other nation that you can pick as a model? If so, do you agree that in addition to their tax rate we should adopt everything else they have there whether it's national health care, no national health care, basically free college tuition, no college tuition, whatever?"

No. Because I cited Ireland first, it doesn't mean it's my favourite, any more than A-AAAMCO is one of the phone company's favourite companies because it comes early in the directory. Second, the size of the US economy and its debt situation are of a size that means that we can't simply imitate some other country. Third, if I support the policy they've attracted companies by reducing taxes and offering incentives, that doesn't automatically mean that I support all their other policies.
And fourth, if Australia has cut taxes to the UK rate and seen revenues improve, while the UK rate has remained steady with more or less revenues, that simply proves my point, which is that cutting improves revenues.

Posted by Seajay | October 18, 2008 3:54 PM
22

It is the econolmy, isn't it?

Gregoire is cutting all programs 1 per cent. yes, a grand 1 per cent.

She has been asleep on this issue, and, it may cost her re-election.

Can't really blame Rossi for her shitty campaign and silly early ads and messages. God, remember the I am voting Gregoire because she will cure my daughters diabetes and Rosssi won't .... totally stupid.

And Rossi had been running the what about the looming short fall in the budget for months.... seems better polling, better consultants.

Either will have to cut to the bone, remember no deficits allowed in this state per the constitution.


By Feb. the deficit will be 5 billion, the Times seem to correct on that.... the real recession is just starting and always gets worse in winter. Seasonal jobs shut down.

"....cutting 1 per cent" ....shit, what lame crap.

Posted by jim | October 18, 2008 4:48 PM
23

This is why I've always subscribed to the PI. The editorial page of the Times is mostly shit.

Posted by local section | October 18, 2008 4:49 PM
24

Dino! Dino! Dino!

Posted by Mr. Poe | October 18, 2008 4:56 PM
25

Dino! Dino! Dino!

Posted by Mr. Poe | October 18, 2008 5:00 PM
26

In defense of the Seattle Times, I do think the quality of their reporting is good. But their editorial page has been crap for a long time. We all know that it's mostly about the estate tax. The Times was so defensive about the issue that in 2006 they said that critics will suggest that their endorsement of Mike McGavick was just due to the estate tax, but that the critics were wrong. Yeah, right.

Posted by Ogre Mage | October 18, 2008 5:02 PM
27

Dino! Dino! Dino!

Posted by Mr. Poe | October 18, 2008 5:02 PM
28

Dino! Dino! Dino!

Posted by Mr. Poe | October 18, 2008 5:03 PM
29

The Times had many, many letters to the editor supporting Christine, and lots of the real truth about Dino "pocket lint for the BIAW" Rossi. This endorsement is very suprising. I wonder, do they read their own newspaper?

Posted by Clarence Geyen | October 18, 2008 10:19 PM
30

The Times also endorsed Bush in 2000. That's all you need to know.

Posted by WTF | October 18, 2008 10:23 PM
31

Yeah, I have a plan to cut the deficit. It's called wait three years. "Gregoire's" surplus of two years ago and future deficit are both direct results of the state's moronic reliance on the sales tax as the main source of funding. Sales tax receipts are incredibly volitile so just waiting three years for this recession to work itself out will probably result in a huge surplus with no actual work required.

Posted by Patrick | October 18, 2008 10:29 PM
32

As I enumerated in Sound Politics, the Seattle Times has been making quite a number of trend setting moves to transform themselves from a paper with a website -- to a website.

The graphics, high use of feedback posts and basic fora for sports discussions are really well done (using mySQL/phpbbs). They are definitely breaking beyond the "Metro area" and trying to become a true Washington media source.

So, it was more likely they'd pick a true statewide candidate, Rossi, over the entrenched and localized Gregoire who had to shore up her political base by hiring as many people in Olympia as she could.

Posted by John Bailo | October 18, 2008 10:59 PM
33

I encountered Dino Rossi in person at the 2004 Issaquah Salmon Days. I was at a booth trying to get people registered (the 45th Dems booth). This was soon after Dino and his kids saw Bush at the White House. I told him that I hated how Bush had squandered the good will of the world for us after 9/11.

Dino asked me, "That bothers you?"

"Damn right it bothers me," I replied.

Dino is a Bushie!

Posted by Barbara | October 19, 2008 2:37 AM
34

perhaps i'll run for gov in '12 so i can legislate MY beliefs on how to limit males' use of their reproductive system, and see how mr. poe likes that.

Posted by not a scrotum toter | October 19, 2008 6:16 AM
35

@3 I totally agree. While I think Gregoire has been an adequate governor, with as many hits as misses, she's perhaps the worst statewide campaigner I've ever seen. BIAW money for Rossi or not, she's gotten her ass handed to her. Further, regardless of the trust behind her deal with the casinos, signing that agreement so close to an election shows terrible political instincts. Of course Rossi was going to use it against her (even while posing as a Native American).

Posted by I Got Nuthin' | October 19, 2008 7:08 AM
36

Should be "truth", not "trust".

Preview, dammit, preview.

Posted by I Got Nuthin' | October 19, 2008 7:10 AM
37

Okay, this may be a dumb question . . .

Once, a friend--who lived in DC for a while--told me that the Washington Times tends towards liberal and that the Washington Post tends towards conservation. Now I have no idea firsthand if that's true or not. But I stupidly assumed that the Times was liberal and the PI was conservative . . .but maybe that's not true . . .

However, some of Dan Savage's posts are titled "Shit's in the PI". Like conservative shit? Or like conservative shit because the PI is actually liberal and they can do better than saying conservative shit? I don't get it.

Another thing: The Times is locally owned. The PI is owned by Hearst Papers, as in founded by the late William Randolph Hearst, who doesn't strike me as remotely liberal or even moderate at all. Also, Hearst is a big corporation and is not local, is not based in the NW. They're a big damn corp.; they don't care.

Posted by hey hey | October 19, 2008 6:45 PM
38

Damn I meant "the Washington Post tends towards conservative". Hopefully everyone though will tend towards conservation sooner rather than later. :)

Posted by hey hey | October 19, 2008 6:49 PM
39

@37: You can get a pretty good idea of each paper's editorial spectrum by reading their respective opinion pages. Try it.

Posted by Greg | October 20, 2008 1:08 PM

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