2008 Letter of the Weekend
posted by on October 13 at 9:27 AM
Received on Sunday morning:
Why are you so obsessed with Hutcherson? Is it not God—not mere mortals—who should grab our attention on all matters, including homosexuality?It is a fearful thing to be found in the hands of the Living God.
Read His Word. Re-read Romans 1. If you truly are compassionate towards those oriented toward homosexuality, you will uproot your entire construct and refrain from contributing to their curse. Moreover, especially as you observe the times and events transpiring before our eyes, you will tremble and repent, and will wholeheartedly trust, love, and obey the One who is returning, Faithful and True.
Eternity is a long time.
Be blessed.
Amen.
The author didn't even sign the letter? What a chickenshit.
What part of the phrase "your god does not exist in my universe" do you not understand? I have nothing to repent of and no one to repent to. I exist on the principals of physics and nature. Banging your bible/book/torah/scripture/tenaments etc. over my head just gives me a headache and a burning desire to slap you with a wet squirrel.
I read Romans, and was under the impression that it was written by a guy who had some serious issues.
No! Don't uproot your entire construct, man!
I love it when these kooks go straight for the faux-Biblical William Jennings Bryan rhetorical style. It's just another aspect of their emotional fascism.
Tremble and repent!
Gay sex causes hurricanes...
Sex causes me to tremble...if I'm lucky.
I was immediately drawn to the New Age-ified Jonathon Edwards bit regarding "in the hands of the Living God." I see we've gone from Him being "angry" to His current state of merely "living," which, in my view, erodes the Almighty from His previous presentation as hairy thunderer to one more resembling a cosmic muffin. It makes Him sound like a couch potato.
But no matter...Eli has now received the emailed word of Jeebus, G-d, etc., and while our earthly news writer may well tremble, receipt of that email obviously did not preclude him from kicking ass on the pitch yesterday, where we saw no evidence that "his foot shall slide in due time." (Deut. 32:35; Edwards).
Carry on.
Blah, blah, blah ... You never tire of reading your book of myths and superstitions. Myths and superstitions and halucinations. Wrapped up in ways to control people and GET THEIR MONEY. And your imaginary hell doesn't scare me either. You should tell your bull to the legions of child molesters you seem to attract. And pick up a history book instead and read about all the murder and torture commited by you "Christians" over the last two thousand years.
And DIRECTLY AFTER the "these people are cursed and did many unclean things like gay sex in biblical times" part came...
And the very fact that we choose to deem SOME of these things important (like gay sex) and others extremely UNimportant (say, "envy" (every effective TV commercial in existence?) and "disobedient children", to name a few).
And some adjectives I could use to describe every bible-thumping web commenter I've ever encountered:
Fracking cylons
When I was a kid I was scared of imaginary monsters too.
Giffy - I think God is more like an imaginary friend than an imaginary monster. He takes the blame for bad things when they happen, he helps people get over their fears of things, he helps people to deal with stressful situations, etc.
As I recall, you're not supposed to convince a child that their friend does not exist, you're just supposed to humor them unless the friend starts telling them to do destructive, naughty things. I like to treat religious people much the same way...
Oh, and I'm always careful to try not to sit on God. Apparently, he hates that.
It wouldn't be your fault, Julie. He's everywhere.
yeah seriously julie, the guy's got a weight problem.
i've never really read the bible close enough to catch all the coded stuff. what phrase is actually used to refer to 'gay sex' or homosexuality in general?
and is romans 1 or whatever pre-jesus? and was it the fork that ran away with the spoon, was that in the same book?
Let me give you some perspective from the progressive Christian point of view, rather than someone who relies on prooftexts taken out of context to make points.
First of all, Paul frankly advocated celibacy for everyone, even those who were married. He was writing at a time when the Christian community believed that Jesus was coming back at any time, and they had to be prepared for that, which included sexual purity.
Second, Paul, a Hellinstic Jew, was writing for a Roman Gentile audience who held far different values than he did. At least part of his agenda was to convince that audience that Jewish morality - even if they didn't follow things like dietary laws - was the path for followers of Christ to follow. Paul was not what we would call a culturally sensitive man.
Third, the whole thing in Romans 1: 18-32 (which I had to go back and read - I don't tend to memorize Scripture) was written in an Hellenistic Jewish style of rhetoric. When Paul was talking about "unnatural desires" and males doing "shameful things" with other males, he was using sexual terminology to speak about sinfulness in general. @10 above provides the last verses, the rest of the story, which confirms that idea.
Throughout his writings, Paul was especially hard on hypocrites, those who were touting the superiority of their faith and morality in public, and doing things that were quite different in public. His whole purpose in the last few verses of Romans 1 was to indict those who were hypocrites, and he used the sexual example to do it, which isn't all that surprising given that Paul was all about celibacy for all.
I know none of you probably care about any of this, but after reading so many comments on so many posts that indict Christianity and Christians as a whole as intolerant, backward, and, frankly, stupid, I couldn't sit by quietly anymore.
I'm not saying that there aren't an awful lot of Christians out there who fit all those descriptors - I think we all know there are. They take one verse, or even part of a verse, of the Bible out of context and use it to prove whatever idea they have decided is the "right one". And they never, ever consider the cultural context in which Scripture was written.
But there are also Christians out there who take a scholarly approach to Scripture, and who understand that while God may have inspired the writers, He (or She) didn't actually put the words down on paper Himself. The Bible evolved over thousands of years, and with lots and lots of human intervention. Most progressive, mainline Christians (and even Catholics if they understood their own theology - which most don't...though most mainline, progressive Christians don't understand their theology either), realize that what is important about the Bible is the underlying truths it teaches, not that every word is literally true.
I could go on and give examples where this is the case, but like I said, most of you probably don't care anyway. I feel better now that I said my piece.
How do you argue with someone who thinks that an omnipotent, omniscient being couldn't find a better way to get his message out than by writing it in a book - in a language that died out after a mere few centuries. Cuz huge, neon letters spanning the sky from horizon to horizon would be what, too gay?
sheryl, sweetheart, do us all a favor and never sit quietly by again. your level headed approach to religion is in dire need world wide, and this country in particular needs all moderate christians out there to tell the nutjobs out there to shut the fuck up.
i would further like to apologize for demeaning your beliefs with my fork and the spoon crack. it was reactionary and unfair of me
it's 'tenents', muggims, not 'tenements'. do i have to correct everyone's spelling on here? guess so, as i am the smartest person on slog. just ask fnarf, hernandez and laura. and jonah spangenthal-lee.
Sheryl - we (or at least I) always appreciate a measured, thoughtful Christian perspective.
Know that while I (and people like me on Slog) may make jokes about imaginary friends and flying spaghetti monsters, in real life, I am always very respectful of those who are religious. At least those who respect my right to be non-religious and to live my life in a way that I choose.
Unfortunately, folks like you are generally outnumbered in this country by the wingnuts and that creates a tendency for people to be dismissive of all religious people.
@19m actually STM, it's "tenets." Now I'm the smartest person on Slog, but you remain the best organic gardener.
Yeah, what Sheryl said! And speaking as a progressive Christian myself, I'd like to say this to the nutjobs - STFU!
no, corndog, I am still the smartest person on SLOG. my team won SLOG happy trivia. had you been at SLOG happy and formed a team, you WOULD be the smartest person on slog. but you ain't. and yes, i know, it's 'tenets'. tenets, anyone? mr. poe, where are you?
I tend to think moderate religious types give credence to the fundamentalists as both stand for the nonsensical proposition that faith is a valid way to truth. Arguing from the bible is just as stupid whether we are talking poverty or gays. Hell at least the fundamentalists actually read the words written. Same with pretending you have an all powerful friend in the sky who agrees with you. If we accept that as valid then what makes the fundamentalists wrong ad the progressive right? After all how do you argue with faith?
The arguments from progressive Christians are just as silly and unfounded, despite the fact that they may not have as negative an affect. If we really want to get beyond such things then we as a society need to leave faith and gods behind.
"...you will tremble and repent, and will wholeheartedly trust, love, and obey the One who is returning, Faithful and True."
Shouldn't 'returning' (and other Holy Words!) be Capitalized to show Respect to God The Father And All Of Those Other Wacky Parts Like Holy Ghosts, Etc.?
I much prefer (if I had to pick a favorite devout theist's take on gayness) the Muslim dad's view on Skins:
As the second-ranking member of the winning trivia team, by virtue of Scary's disqualification for "tenents" I am the smartest person on Slog.
loudest != most representative
Tenement:
1. A building for human habitation, especially one that is rented to tenants.
2. A rundown, low-rental apartment building whose facilities and maintenance barely meet minimum standards.
It would really hurt to be hit over the head with one of these...even a walk-up. I'm sorry for my sloppy typing. I still want to slap Ken Hucherson with a wet squirrel.Please?
'tain't gonna argue with you, fnarf, as i like you too much for that. however, fredddddd hampton!!!!
@24 - I'm not going to get into an argument with you over progressive vs. funamentalist Christianity. I could show you the differences in scholarship, approach to theology, etc., but I don't think it would make a lick of difference in your mind.
And faith is not the only way to truth. It is the way I personally espouse and that works for me, but I think that, for example you can arrive at the conclusion that we need to take care of those in society who have been left behind economically, educationally, etc., as easily by observing the world around me as by hearing and believing Matthew 25:31-46 (and yes, I had to look that up to get the chapter and verses). I happen to believe that empirical, rational observation and faith don't necessarily need to be completely separate entities.
Can you argue with faith? Probably not. But you can't argue with lack of faith, either.
The fact of the matter is that none of us, religious or not, will know the truth of things until we are dead. My faith tells me there is something more, but I can't know that empirically or rationally. I may be proven wrong in the end, but then again, so might you.
@31, The correct response when faced with something we don't know is not to simply make shit up. Dressing up your guesses as faith does not make them any less so.
I think that, for example you can arrive at the conclusion that we need to take care of those in society who have been left behind economically, educationally, etc., as easily by observing the world around me
Yes you can. The difference is that when basing things on observation you have actual evidence from which to make claims.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha hah!
The religious are truly incapable of making sense.
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