Comments on Townhouses and Trader Joe's

Bitter much Dan?

Well, good thing you're doing your part.

With out horrid vitriol, slog-power may one day bring this unwanted turn-of-events to a grinding halt. By complaining about it.

By complaining about it.

try living on the Eastside

I dunno. It kinda gets to me that it's so impossibly easy to pick on feel-good columnists like Westneat. What if you had to write an article about this, Savage? What would you say exactly?

Is no one going to comment on the appearance of that little old lady's house? Mediocre at best, kinda ugly at worst. It's nice that she stuck to her guns and stayed in the house she loved, but it's no net gain in the attractiveness of housing in Seattle.

*our. Or *out. They're both interchangeable. Fun!

I suppose those of us with book deals with major publishers don't have to worry about being priced out of apartments.

I love you @7

Damn right! There's no place for me and my handlebar mustachioed friends to workout in our unitards and play with our medicine balls.

I am getting sour about losing so many "old school" businesses and houses in Seattle. Swear to God if they take away the 5 Point dive for some condo shit I'm gonna take a hostage.

And people wonder why Slog commenters spew such vitriolic hate.

Hint: It's because of shortsighted and utterly retarded "arguments" like these.

Yes "Old Seattle" was only about a Denny's. Exactly!

I wonder if Seattleites of the 1930s and 40s sat around griping about all these new transplants and their fancy new storefronts - the same ones that natives bemoan the loss of now - were crowding out that Old West charm.

"about all" = "about how all"

goddamnit MUST LEARN TO TYPE

I like the development of New Seattle. Makes me feel like I'm living in a place that at least yearns to grow.

The frame of reference for Old Seattle is changing all the time and I'm likely to consider the current time as Old Seattle in 60 years.

Whew, that was brisk. Dan, have you considered an enema? That clean feeling can really brighten your whole outlook.

I look forward to Dan's "Gosh the Iraq War is so evil. Saddam's regime had SOUL; Man, those were the days" post.

It's that kind of snarkiness that gets John Doe all riled up.

but the fact is, density IS good, but poor design review and a lack of intelligent city planning is bad.

How many lumpen townhomes, tanning salons, Juliet balconies and Quiznos does a city need?

Sooooooo....

Dan--how old's the house you live in? Wouldn't you be happier in a new, half-million, 700 sq. ft. condo above a Quiznos?

michael, the city has like 15 quiznos, 5 of which, off the top of my head, populate mixed use buildings or commercial buildings in relatively more dense parts of seattle.

Dan,What are you talking about?

Side note: that old lady in Ballard should have taken the million bucks, bought another house and paid someone a few thou to move all her stuff. She would have lived mcuh longer.

Now, she is becoming the mascot, not for fighting the powers that be, but for a monolith capitalizing on the quaintness of her futile mortality.

Good thing I don't live in the slumurbs like Dan.

Like most people around here, I embrace the growth, and want it to keep making our region more energy efficient, less global-warming polluting, and more transit and townhouse friendly.

Even if some of us realize the logical progression is to mixed-income 40 to 100 story tall residential rental apartment buildings with adjacent publicly-accessible greenspace. As in lower ($20K or less), lower-middle, middle, upper-middle, and upper income mixed on the same floors and only segregated by the view potential and the size of the floorplan.

That way leads to victory over the America-hating Saudis that plot our destruction - even if they live in Pakistan or other countries.

Condensed version of this post:

"Many people in Seattle fear change. They liked Seattle the way it was. But I like Trader Joe's and health clubs. So fuck those people. I am mocking them!"

Thinking on this more I just hope that every bar on Capital Hill gets torn down and replaced with mixed use buildings. The Cuff: GONE!! Madison Pub? New High Price Condos! Purr? A brand new Subway! The War Room? A parking lot (to go with the parking lot that used to be Manray and Pony)

Onward with development! And that Space Needle needs to go to: It is SOOO retro 60's!!

I blame the Californians, they moved up here and started the whole growth thing. They sold their million dollar houses in CA, moved up here, and brought all the California stuff with them (minus the sun).

Trader Joes's sucks, period. It's ironic that the very people who shop at them profess things like "sustainability" and "eco-friendly" when shopping at a store that sells mostly processed foods. You can't even get most of the raw materials you'd need to make your own breads, pastas, or cookies. If I can't buy the necessary ingredients to cook my meals from scratch, then it doesn't qualify as a grocery store. Trader Joes's is 7-11 for rich people.

@22, wow, you're right. On first read, I thought Dan was joining the mockery and revulsion of the execrable Trader Joes, IKEA and soulless, hideous strip mall townhouse complexes.

I get it now; the point was that the market should dictate what crap gets shat on us. People get the Republican presidents, Shrek musicals, Starbucks and cardboard Quizno's "sandwiches" they deserve, because they are willing to pay for them.

@25

Trader Joes attracts young, single people because they offer single serving meals that consist of something other than junkfood. Which is more sustainable and eco-friendly than throwing out half of what you bought at Safeway. And expecting all single people to prepare a full, balanced meal for one, from scratch, every day, is just... well. Let's just say, not pragmatic.

Plus, if you play your cards right you could end up married to one of the other shoppers you met there.

My God. Your literary devices are tiresome.

Especially since they in no way help me understand the difference between a health club and a gym.

@26, I get it, I should never get to enjoy some things I like because other people have a problem with them. I shouldn't be able to pay for something I enjoy because it might have a spillover cost on someone else's intangible aesthetic of the city. In fact what I get to enjoy should be determined by legal remedy designed by the people who were here first.

@24
yeah, and can we send all those people with european ancestry back to europe? I mean they came here with so much more relative wealth than the natives and ruined everything for the natives.

throwing out half of what you bought at Safeway

If you find yourself doing this, you're doing it wrong.

expecting all single people to prepare a full, balanced meal for one, from scratch, every day, is [...] not pragmatic

I dispute this. I used to live on the hill , as a single man in an apartment by himself, a couple of years ago and shopped regularly at the QFC on Broadway and I cooked all of my meals at home and dined at restaurants less than twice a week, on average. And in case you never noticed, an awful lot of people go to grocery stores, this one especially (young people too!), people I'd much rather marry than those that frequent the upscale convenience stores.

let me be the 1st not to love the old lady: she was fucking STUPID.

@24

Don't blame me, I left Seattle for California!

@25,

I shop at TJ's at least once a week and I cook almost everything from scratch. Their prices on fruit, vegetables, and dairy are comparable to and often better than regular grocery stores, especially QFC. I bought two bell peppers there the other day for less than $2. Those things run $3-4 a pop elsewhere.

Dan, you're being a bit too dismissive, methinks. Part of people's misgivings (at best) or vitriol (at worst) isn't so much the development in and of itself, but the nature of that development and the accompanying retail spaces. There's nothing "wrong" with a Quiznos, but why does it have to be a Quiznos and not an independent sub shop? Why another Trader Joe's and not a local chain like Top Foods/Haggen (Yes, they are local, unlike TJ's, Safeway, QFC, or everyone's beloved Whole Foods)? And all the "old" (30-50 y.o.) homes in Ballard may draw from a range of similar plans, at least they're not almost literally cookie-cuttered in design, layout and exterior color. There's still enough variety to make things interesting and not dull.

Careful Dan, your playing rough with the local sacred cows... (They may have a meeting, form an exploratory committee, take public comments, do an environmental impact study, go back to committee, reach consensus and resolve to pass a non-binding resolution to gore you.)

laterite, the reason that it has to be quiznos and not an indie sub shop is because

a. quiznos has the capital to expand and can weather the risk of it failing
b. people that might be inclined to start a sub shop might be disinclined to do so in a retail space below condos because they are bitter about the change of the neighborhood.

To summarize Savage's thoughts on the matter:

Development in Ballard: always good
Development along Pike/Pine: NO PLEASE GOD DON'T TAKE OUR FAVORITE BARS

I get your first point, BA@36, but can we say for certain that an independent sandwich-lover and entrepreneur gets an equal opportunity for that space as the Quiznos? I'm not so sure they get a fair shake over the franchises. If yes, then sure, let the best bid win. I don't know your second point holds water, unless there's evidence that local entrepreneurs actually feel this way. If I were one, I would take whatever opportunity came my way in a new development, provided I was given a level playing field.

Walked down Pike between 12th and Broadway the other night and the sidewalks were PACKED. It felt almost...like a city...shame no one planned any transit that would be ready by the time Gen X turns 50.

perhaps there is an unlevel playing field in that quiznos has more money to bid on retail space. I'm trying to imagine how the playing field can be unfair in such a way that quiznos is not at least paying the market rate for the ability to be in that retail space.

and looking at the responses that many people here have, I can feel the seething resentment from them, and it isn't too implausible that a lot of local people would rather take their ball and go home rather than be a part of the new development. they'd rather say "fuck you, I'm not going to pay rent to these developers that ruined my neighborhood"

Fuck you. I'm not going to pay rent to these developers who ruined my neighborhood.

Except they are.

Note: oh wowie zowie there were 287 housing units added in Ballard. Ohmygod ohmygod ohmygog!

Could this mean we are a .....[shudder].....city?

I like the rash of new townhouses. They're nowhere near as ugly as the rash of dingbats that went up in the 70s, or the rash of vomitous plastic-sided apartment houses that went up all over the city in the 80s. People see the new buildings because they're new and they haven't faded into the background noise yet, but they will.

Why do "Progressives" hate progress so much?

I used to think the story about the little old lady was cute, until I saw the picture. Rightfully or not, in light of her death, I began to think that she was merely selfish and had a part in creating one of the most ridiculous blocks I've ever seen.

The developers are, of course, partly to blame, but there comes a point when all of your neighbors give up their houses and you should step back and realize that making a stand and leaving one lone house on the block is going to make your block less attractive than if the entire block had been filled with the development. It's not "Old Ballard" anymore just because one house remains, but it isn't exactly "New Ballard" either, since the full potential of the development seems to be severely hampered by the remaining house.

Hopefully the developers can snag the lot and create a nice courtyard or an addition to the development that doesn't look completely absurd.

Napoleon always brightens my day.

"She got what she wanted," said Charlie Peck, a longtime friend. "She wanted to die at home, in the same house, on the same couch, where her mother had died. That's what she was so stubborn about."

Once a couch, sofa, or settee has claimed at least two victims, it becomes a prime candidate for a new Stephen King novel. o.0

So long as it's not an M. Night Shyamalan movie, the couch can do whatever it wants, Nappy.

@42, envy of so-called "world class cities" is one of the worst traits of Stranger writers. Let's not let it spread.

@45, it's hardly selfish for someone to not sell their property to a developer. Stubborn, maybe, especially in this case. But not selfish.

#50, she stayed in the house for her own personal, nostalgic reasons. She ignored the rather awkward future of her block and those that will have to deal with it in the future. I'd say that's at least a bit selfish.

Seriously, have you *seen* the photo of the block? It's hard to recover from that.

ahhh The Stranger, so urbane, so sardonic, so smug and elitist; true trendsetters the lot of 'em, well if the trend is wallowing in mediocrity and disdaining the poor, that is.

Dan. It's about losing our culture and our identity as a community. It's not about phobia or aversion to progress.

You're missing the point.

@51, she didn't stay in the house at the expense of some greater community good, some societal benefit, etc. She refused to sell the house that she owned to make way for an LA Fitness and a Trader Joe's. Boo hoo. So selfish not to make way for a fitness center!

Besides, I think the block is more interesting this way. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

amp, go make some money, get together with other people who have also made some money, and put your money where your desires and values are.