um, when will the police be exactly cracking down on motorists who nearly run over pedestrians in crosswalks, pray tell?

All you self-righteous anti-bike dorks need to think about that next time it takes 45 minutes for an officer to respond when your car has been stolen or your home broken into.

But I'd feel better if, say, corps of cops were sent out to ticket errant cyclists late on weekend nights, perhaps at the corners of Pike and Broadway, so cops might just nab a stabber or basher while protecting our precious traffic laws.

I've lost track of the number of times I've had to duck incoming traffic. Even better when is when they wave me along as I walk with the light because, y'know, I'm keeping them from their next Starbucks fix!

The data say that Seattle has a lower violent crime rate than other cities. Yet nonviolent crime is high -- we're near the very top in that category. Pedestrian injuries are high. The evidence says that the cops are already pouring all their resources into violent crime and there's nothing left over for anything else.

No city our size in the US has a smaller police force. How can that not have a major impact somewhere?

Mmmmmm...pie. I hope its apple.

And on top of that, despite the years worth of evidence, it always pisses me off that the Slog is such a "law-and-order" crowd. My perspective says the police are bullies who can always be counted on to harass the people who don't have the resources to fight back - minorities, young people, immigrants, skateboarders and yes, bicyclists. Car drivers and wealthy people in general get a free pass. I say fuck the cops and to hell with their authority.

I jaywalk at least 3-4 times a day... if I ever get a ticket, I will suck it up, because I willfully choose to ignore the law. Yeah, the police have better things to do, and I'm more careful when I cross in the middle of the block, etc., etc. But the fact is, I break the law when I jaywalk, so if I'm caught, too bad for me.

Also, Derrick Ito is a fatty!

If bicycles ride in the road, they need to follow the rules of the road. Which includes stopping at red lights and stop signs.

Contrary to Gurldoggie, not every act of a police officer is bullying, and not all car drivers are rich. Nor are all bike riders poor. That's one of the most uninformed generalizations I've heard in a while. Like I said, 13 year old angst.

If a semi ever hits you and you die on impact, I will be here on Slog to laugh about it.

Blindly blowing through stop signs on a bike is stupid and gives us all a bad name. But the intersection of 34th and Evanston is a pretty simple one to navigate without coming to a full stop on a bike.

I'd love to know the details of the infractions of those being ticketed. Were they doing 20mph? 5mph? And what direction were they coming from? Because if you're familiar with this spot, you'll know that not all stop signs at this intersection are created equal.

As for this being a waste of city resources: No shit. A complete waste. And SPD still hasn't found my bike.

it's only used to make a point.

Eh, but it's a point that needs making. Cyclists break the law regularly in Seattle because they're apparently quite confident they can. Or because they're barely even aware they're bound by laws at all.

Seattle, and in particular Fremont at 8:25am, may be low crime communities, but there are places in this city that are fairly high-crime at all hours of the day, where it is virtually impossible to get a timely request for assistance. I think of my old neighborhood around Broadway and Boren as a place where, when you called in a report on the numerous drug dealers that work that area, you would almost never get a response, let alone some patrol time through the neighborhood. And the situation as you go farther south down Rainier is much worse.

Don't all you law and order types think this might register as a slightly higher priority than ticketing some cycling yuppie on a side street on his way to work? I suppose it is sending a message to the bikers, but the message being sent to those in underserved communities is much more powerful. And believer me, they are all hearing it loud and clear.

34th and Evanston give me a break. Like that's a fucking dangerous intersection.

You pro-cop pro-law pro-ticket people weird me out.

Signs don't save people -- people save people. Signs aren't real. Use your brains. It will all be OK! Baaa baaaa.

You are little children with a toy fetish. You think you are above the law, while everyone must obey it. You think that somehow the use of a fucking bike makes you somehow superior.

When I am making a right turn onto Dexter, I make sure I cut off and freak out as many of you shit heads as I can. Fuck you and your stupid little toy. I can only hope when you run the light at Harrison, I am making a right turn and turn you into a quadroplegic.

The funniest thing about you shitting in a diaper and not having you arms work for the rest of your life you ask? Your insurance will pay for the damage to my Toyota.

Fuckwads.

So that's why there were so few bikers ...

34th and Evanston give me a break. Like that's a fucking dangerous intersection.

You pro-cop pro-law pro-ticket people weird me out.

Signs don't save people -- people save people. Signs aren't real. Use your brains. It will all be OK! Baaa baaaa.

Goodantaug.

I've got no inherent problem with this, or any other "make a point" patrol that they want to do. But it's a confusing contrast when you've got all these officers anonymously complaining about how short-staffed they are, and at the same time their highest-profile work involves ticketing cyclist/jaywalkers/etc.
and you've got a steady stream of complaints from the public regarding SPD's slow response to things like burglaries and thefts.

Squirting super glue on bikers seats while "parked".

Also, try spreading dog shit on the handlebar grips. hey love that. After all, its organic!!!

Now thats the gift that keeps on giving.

Too bad they didn't impound your precious pedal machine.

You look like an idiot in all that "Gear".

REI must love you.

When I see a bicyclist, I have no idea if he's going to stop at the stop sign, or stop at the red light (and then run it) or not stop at the red light at all. It's usually about a 50/50 proposition. So my defensive reaction is: expect every cyclist to do something absolutely stupid -- because too often, they will.

Oh, before comparing with cars that run red lights, that occurs during the 1 - 3 seconds after the light turns red. Can't recall the last time I saw a car just blow through a light that was red on the approach -- common practice among the cycling community, alas.

So, go SPD. And yes, when the 911 call comes in, drop the ticketing and respond.

I'm not "pro-cop pro-law pro-ticket", but thanks for assuming so on the grounds that I'm anti-dumb fucking bicyclists who think their actions either don't matter or aren't comparable in any way to drivers on the road. You share the road with drivers. When the light is red, the light is red. There is no "judgment", you do what you're told. That's why it's there.

Nice stereotyping. But other than name calling and over-generalization, anybody got data?

I see that all the time in this city. In fact, I saw a car blow through a light (that had been red for a good long time) on my way to work this morning.

As much as the cyclist is in the wrong, it's not as simple as "you ran a stop sign, ergo you will assume 100% liability."

Reality is, the cyclist probably won't pay anything as few (any?) cyclists carry insurance for their bicycle as would a driver for his car. If anyone pays, it will likely be your insurance under your UIM coverage.

And as for "you shitting in a diaper and not having you (sic) arms work for the rest of your life", you will likely pay for that as well with all sorts of civil liability suits for which you will get to retain a lawyer. And with such an unrepentent attitude that you just advertised in public, virtually any lawyer can demonstrate to a jury that you displayed intentional criminal negligence entering the intersection.

After which I will retain a lawyer to sue them for mental anguish and distress in addition to property damage my vehicle.

If I am not at fault, I am not at fault. If they damage me as a result of the commission of a illegal act, then I will be made whole.

I have no compassion for the criminally stupid.

Now, go back to class kiddo.

@51 and @22: how fast do you think an officer on a bicycle in Fremont can respond to a drug call in Rainier Beach? Even if they drop the ticket book and go, like, really fast? Maybe it would be a better idea to have these people patrolling high-crime neighborhoods to begin with?

Seattle as a whole is very low-crime, but there are still areas that are not. And that's where the police should be. Not at 34th and Evanston for gods sake.

I run stop signs all of the time, but that doesn't mean I blow through them at full speed. I slow down, look both ways, and if there is nobody coming I continue without unclipping from my pedals. I would like to live to a ripe old age. It is in my interest to be safe, and I believe that what I do is the safest way to proceed through an intersection.

Cops give tickets for revenue, not for safety. The pigs will always have resources for giving tickets, because it pays for itself. It's a good racket ... er I mean it's a good business model.

Despite breaking the law, does anyone really think that @52 was being irresponsible or unsafe?

I’d just like to say I find it a little silly for staking out such a high bike traffic/ low car traffic sign. It’s kinda like shooting fish in a barrel. I’m sure there are some more dangerous locations they could have chosen.

This was my 1st ticket in three years. I usually ride in around 6:15am. There is almost no traffic. So, on average I slow and roll through 7-10 signs/light per morning, and stop and roll through another 4-5.

That works out to pocket change per light. I just hope my $103 goes to something good.

And I wish people would stop referring to this bicyclist as having run a "light". There's no light there. It's not a dangerous intersection or busy street, except for bikes and peds.

I suspect that you don't understand how the precinct system is set up. Cops in fremont don't respond to "Drug call's" in Ranier Valley.

And I find it HILARIOUS, that all you whining pissy little bitches on your childrens toys are complaining about getting caught doing something illegal, and suggesting that the cops go after DRUGS!!!!

Well, try to remember that bullshit the next time you start whining about victimless crime, legalizing drugs, etc...

Fuck you

We've seen stories lately about how the cops won't even investigate hit and run drivers when witnesses give them the license plate, or about how they can find the time on 2nd and 3rd shift to go harass Capitol Hill clubs for being too loud, and the law and order schmucks posting here can say this is an effective use of resources with straight face?

Wow, just wow.

Oh, and Ecce - you're still a loathsome piece of shit (sorry to the rest of y'all for feeding the troll).

I love these bicycle chats.

bcuz they're a bigger hazard than bikes.

go fuck yourself...

lovely thought to laugh at a violent death

you an annoying little faggot who thinks he's clever

All this bickering, speechifying and all the ad hominem attacks in the world won't significantly change the opinions of those already entrenched in their myopic assessments of humanity (with particular regard to the bicycle-riding segment).

This thread is now about tacos.

I like mine with guacamole.

This is not to excuse red light/stop sign runners. The uncertainty that comes with that has a pretty negative impact all around regardless of what you're driving.

Jonah wrote a story about police officers responding slowly because they lacked resources. This is a story about SPD brass and/or the city responding to citizen complaints.

Without talking to a single bike-ticketing officer, I can guarantee they'd rather bust violent criminals or solve crimes than deal with "I know which laws I have to obey" bicyclists.

Please don't confuse the SPD with the cops who follow its orders.

Tacos: Chicken with cilantro.

And to The Subject - my sympathies, regardless of anyone's take on SPD's priorities or lack thereof. Getting a ticket sucks, even if you're guilty of the offense. Go to the court date-- maybe you can at least get the fine knocked down.

similar behavior for a car would include:

1. not stopping at the stop sign, but stopping slightly in front of it so you can see around the corner. i was pulled over for this once. even though i stopped, it was not soon enough.

2. turning while peds are still in the crosswalk. peds have to be a full lane away, or not a all if they are on your side of the street.

3. illegally passing a bicyclist. most cars illegally pass bicyclists when they pass them on the road.

4. speeding.

basically, when operating a vehicle on the road, you adapt to a common-sense approach to certain rules. you can understand if you get a ticket, but still think it's stupid if a sting is set-up for it.

can you imagine a speed trap that ticketed drivers for going 1 mph over the limit?

I don't weave through traffic, I don't jump around, I signal, I stop or do whatever is necessary to avoid pedestrians, I stop at stoplights, I often stop at stop signs.

But I have blown off stop signs. I've also called out clear to other cyclists.

It's not going to change. If you hate cyclists, well fuck you, it's a war out there and we're taking casualties, but so is everyone else. I drive a lot too, needless to say I don't use my car as a weapon of intimidation. That's far more of a shithead move than rolling through a stopsign.

I mean, what are you going to really do about it? If you're one of these nuts who hates bicyclists then fine keep on keeping on.

OTOH, I won't complain about getting a ticket for blowing off a stop sign. If heavy enforcement of road laws against cyclists was a price we could pay for respect for cyclists and enforcement of driver's anti-cyclist behavior I'd be absolutely down for that.

True story.

Thank you for having some sense. It's about the spirit of the law vs the letter of the law. Bikes are somewhat different from cars. For a cyclist, momentum is paramount and being able to roll through a stop very slowly at less than 5mph seems pretty safe to me.

Idaho has *gasp* written a law specifically for cyclists at lights and stop signs. It is as follows:

"(2) A person operating a bicycle or human-powered vehicle approaching a
steady red traffic control light shall stop before entering the intersection
and shall yield to all other traffic. Once the person has yielded, he may
proceed through the steady red light with caution. Provided however, that a
person after slowing to a reasonable speed and yielding the right-of-way if
required, may cautiously make a right-hand turn. A left-hand turn onto a
one-way highway may be made on a red light after stopping and yielding to
other traffic."

Not the same thing, but progressive none the less.

Hell yes! As a fellow vegetarian, I marvel at the selections of faux-meat for my tacos. Yet, I always seem to go with regular smart-ground, go figure.

We use a special taco-sauce from PDX, though.

I only wish there were cops at that intersection the day I was brake checked by some prick who was cut off by a car in front of him, the driver was pissed off so he tried to get me to hit him by stopping short. Or the times cars run up that block the WRONG way to take a right to get on the bridge...or the illegal left turns.

oh yeah, they're only out there on days it isn't raining.

With guacamole?

There was a motorcycle cop at the same intersection yesterday, sitting sneakily just around the corner, out of sight, writing tickets for people who didn’t come to a full stop at the sign before turning right.

But the ironic part of the bike thing:

As far as the "deterrence" aspect of is concerned this is a complete waste of time, because in two weeks the work on the Fremont bridge will be completed and the bike trail under the bridge should re-open, taking all 95% of the bike traffic back off 34th completely when it does!

Also, tacos are best with sour cream.

if only we lived in a city with that kind of parity.

To those who are complaining about crimes happening elsewhere - have you contacted the cops about those specific crimes? Or are you just waiving your hands in the air and saying "LOOK AT ME, DAMMIT, MY LIPS ARE FLAPPING"?

As for SPD having better things to do, this is the traffic section DOING what it is supposed to do. If you bicyclist think you are being singled out and picked on you're not. Sit on 3rd Ave in the early morning or afternoon and watch how many vehicles get pulled over for driving on the closed street and are ticketed. Or you could check out the school zones that traffic sets up the radar to catch speeders. It IS what they do…obey the law, or pay better attention looking for patrols, whether in a vehicle or on a bike.

Also, I'm really fat. And 47. And live in Olympia.

Also, I don't get on well with onions or cilantro, and many purveyors of tacos load 'em up with these items.

Every group-ride I've been on where we stopped at a Taco Truck has been followed by at least one report of diarrhea afterward. I'm not saying that Taco Trucks are dirty or vectors for salmonella or E Coli, I'm just sayin' that they don't agree with everyone.

Home-made tacos are best.

Please delete the message.

Sock puppetry is pathetic.

If you had an ounce of wisdom in your heads your attitude would be more like this: "well, biking is good for the city and good for the planet and it would be better if more people did it, so we should probably cut them some slack on obeying to the letter the traffic rules that were created for cars, which are totally different in terms of the risk they present to people and property."

The only conclusion I can reach is that y'all must have such sad and frustrated lives that you can't help but take it out irrationally on people who actually deserve your thanks.

Those dangerous cyclists!

Scarrrrrrrrrrrrriiiiiiieeeeeee!!!!!!!!

Wonder if Scuzzie Burke had a hand in this...

it seems one of the biggest pet peeves that drivers share is the thought that someone is getting to go faster when you are stuck. it could be the lane next to you moving faster at rush hour. or a car cutting in at the last minute.

drivers will sometimes not let someone turn or into the lane they occupy for this very reason.

so, every time a drivers sees a bicyclist get to flaunt a rule and "go faster" then them, the little anger switch flips in their head. where else would all the self-righteous indignation come from? we want the other to be punished because they didn't follow the rules we follow.

but it's different for a cyclist. they have slightly different mores to determine their behavior. it's not okay to blow through a red light without slowing or checking for cars. no. but to slow at a stop sign? there are not the same dangers of a car failing to stop.

cars have their own rules, too, as i outlined @99. if the police ran a sting to catch something listed there, and bicyclists posted messages like you see here, you would laugh at them.

yes, we all know what the rules are. we also know which rules are okay to bend.