Slog - Comments on Northern Exposure http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure Tired of the flimsy faux-Craftsman townhouses going up all over town? Wish more of the mixed-use developments contained apartments instead of exorbitantly priced condos? Your pleas have been heard, at least, north of the ship canal, where some developers are counting on a thriving rental market for workers who can't afford to buy property near city jobs, and buyers willing pay more for good design. Here, for your viewing pleasure, are four interesting developments breaking ground this year. Click on the intersection link for a map of the surrounding streets. N 40th St and Aurora Ave N For the briefest... Copyright 2008 Tue, 05 Feb 2008 15:34:31 -0800 Wed, 06 Feb 2008 00:45:07 -0800 http://www.movabletype.org/?v=3.34 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Comment by Hernandez Well now, that's not bad at all. Still a bit iffy on the massing of the proposed building at 40th and Stone Way, but even if it ended up being the mishmash of odd shapes that it appears to be now, it would still be better than another round of faux-craftsmans.

]]> Hernandez http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925277 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925277 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 15:47:15 -0800 Comment by Mittens Schrodinger Seriously? 400K for a 2-BD townhome at 105th and Greenwood? Will those things actually sell up there at that price?

]]> Mittens Schrodinger http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925285 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925285 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 15:50:46 -0800 Comment by elenchos "Faux-Craftsman!" I've been waiting to hear that term on the Slog.

Why, you ask, in your endearing Sloggy tone that sort of makes me want to jump your bones?

Let me tell you why. I've looked around Seattle at "real" Craftsman houses, built in the 20's and so on, and they seem to be all about facades. They have like these hollow wooden pylons on their porches, or false brackets that pretend to support the eaves. Which I think is just fine. But is a "real" Craftsman an honest building, in the way Frank Lloyd Wright talked about a building being honest?

And if not, then a more recent re-creation of a Craftsman can't really be faux. Can it?

]]> elenchos http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925301 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925301 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 15:54:44 -0800 Comment by Andrew It seems odd to me that you can build to six storeys on LCW but only to four storeys on Aurora.

]]> Andrew http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925307 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925307 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 15:58:31 -0800 Comment by jonglix @3 interesting, but I will say that the old stuff looks a lot better. The oranments are fake but at least they suggest quality craftmanship whereas the new stuff is clearly pre-fab.

]]> jonglix http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925315 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925315 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:06:03 -0800 Comment by Fnarf All it needs to do to "relate to Fremont and Wallingford" is to NOT BE A GIGANTIC HOLE.

Seriously -- these are nice; I like the Greenwood ones. But they're not affordable. Good design, by which most people mean "attractive skin", doesn't matter as much as how big it is and how it faces the street. People are all agitated about a handful of faux-Craftsman, but if you really, really look at the city with fresh eyes you'll see far more and far shittier apartment and condo design from the 70s, 80s and 90s But it doesn't matter.

I am curious about the weird rooftop of the on on 40th & Stone -- is that another story up there, with a rooftop lawn? That's kind of interesting, even if it's "ugly".

The reason it's ugly is because the lot's too big. They should have divided it up into three or four and let the developers do whatever they wanted with the caveat that the roof line and the street setbacks have to be equal.

]]> Fnarf http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925316 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925316 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:06:35 -0800 Comment by Fnarf There are no "real" "Frank Lloyd Wright" Craftsman homes in Seattle. Frank Lloyd Wright houses cost millions of dollars. Our Craftsman homes were mostly built from kits. People at the time were horrified by their cheap, fake, cookie-cutter aesthetic. Now they're beloved neighborhood icons.

]]> Fnarf http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925320 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925320 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:09:19 -0800 Comment by Will in Seattle @2 and @4 are right. But I agree it's strange having a four-story zone in an area where a six-story makes more sense.

And, of course (oblig), wouldn't a few 40 to 100 story inexpensive residential apartment building at the key intersections make sense? Like 40th and Aurora and 40th and Stone ... we could pop an extra stop for the 358 there and it's TOD ... And 40th and Stone is along something like 5 or 6 bus lines (and soon a streetcar).

We need to stop using 20th Century thinking - pro-car pro-Clinton - and start using 21st Century thinking - pro-transit pro-Obama - or we'll never catch up to the rest of the First World and will evermore be doomed to be a backwater nation ...

Hello, Denmark! Hello, Netherlands! Hello, Portugal! Hello, Poland! We're joining you as a has-been superpower!

]]> Will in Seattle http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925324 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925324 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:11:38 -0800 Comment by elenchos Ah! It all makes sense now. Thanks, Fnarf.

]]> elenchos http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925342 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925342 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:18:16 -0800 Comment by ewww Expect to see those empty lots sit there for a very loooooooong time now. At least the old buildings had more character than empty lots or half done construction.

]]> ewww http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925350 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925350 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:21:34 -0800 Comment by Fnarf Fuck you, Will.

]]> Fnarf http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925352 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925352 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:22:10 -0800 Comment by Cale I agree about the severe lack of 3 bedroom rentals. It's pretty much the only reason I don't live in an apartment right now. I mean rental houses are cool for space, but I would rather live somewhere I could walk to the grocery store.

]]> Cale http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925364 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925364 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:26:22 -0800 Comment by scharrera Shout out to my woman Brenda Barnes at Clark! Woot Woot!

]]> scharrera http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925383 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925383 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:34:36 -0800 Comment by Gay Seattle That Safeway on 40th & Stone Way was terrible. I bought some fish there and noticed tiny white worms crawling in it. I PROMPTLY returned to the manager of the store to exchange it for something else and the manager said I could EXCHANGE it out but I would have to pay for any price difference. I never went back again.

]]> Gay Seattle http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925388 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925388 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:35:31 -0800 Comment by COMTE Hm, so it looks like my options are: 1.) lose the downtown view over Lake Union from my office window; 2.) rent a south-facing apartment on the top floor of the building across the street from my office; or 3.) move my office.

]]> COMTE http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925395 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925395 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:38:58 -0800 Comment by Will in Seattle Thanks, Fnarf.

And, Comte, you could always buy a penthouse suite ...

]]> Will in Seattle http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925410 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925410 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:48:34 -0800 Comment by duh. @14) I completelyunderstand you're grievance ... but ... uh ... duh. What were you expecting they do? Let you pick out whatever the hell you wanted and just walk out with it? No. Wakeup.

]]> duh. http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925433 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925433 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 17:01:54 -0800 Comment by Jubilation T. Cornball Development #1 -- Its best side is to Aurora, and that side is inspiring. Sadly, the other side is that hideous sage/dried blood color combo with, you got it, Low Rotterdam cladding and boring window/balcony groupings.

Development #2 -- The proof's in the pudding, but me likey. It's got color, lets in lots of sun, has downright loopy treats for the eye...hell, it looks FUN!

Development #3 -- Disgusting. Howard Roark, your bomb is waiting...

Development #4 -- Looks like the 500 year flood left a waterline on some packing boxes. Revolting.

]]> Jubilation T. Cornball http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925442 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925442 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 17:12:02 -0800 Comment by max solomon when you have to "break up the monotony of the structure" during massing studies, you started in the wrong place.

good luck, bayliss!

]]> max solomon http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925463 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c925463 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 17:23:57 -0800 Comment by rb Dominic, thanks for these posts. I don't always agree with your reviews, but appreciate the contribution to discussion on development and urban planning. Keep 'em coming!

]]> rb http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926005 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926005 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 19:43:57 -0800 Comment by docd 40th & Stone - looks like the roof is stepping up along Stone to match the slope of the street. Is there such a thing as a 'craftsman' apartment building? If there is, I don't want to see it.

]]> docd http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926181 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926181 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 21:05:27 -0800 Comment by Henry Miller Lite @3: Elenchos, are you really trying to tell us that craftsman was actually not an architectural style, and that it was all just about cheap knockoffs of Wright? My advice to you is don't forget about Wiki before you start blogging out your ass again.

I live in a 1913 craftsman and it's the only one I've ever seen without brackets supporting such large overhangs. The only thing supporting the 3 foot overhanging second floor gables is cantilevered beadboard. And guess what, the gables have sagged noticeably over time. Brackets on houses like mine were put there for structural reasons. But contemporary faux craftsman houses are built differently, usually have smaller overhangs, and really don't need supporting brackets.

My house also has a large hollow column supporting the porch corner. Hmm, would it be more honest if it was solid wood? Or maybe it should have been a simple 4x4 post all out of proportion with the rest of the house?

If you can't see any differences between the faux craftsman townhouse schlock going up all over Seattle and the real thing, you might want to think about putting away the crack pipe. And the thing is, the craftsman townhouses are some of the better ones. A big chunk of the new townhouses I've seen lately make those awful 70s and 80s apartments look pretty good in comparison.

]]> Henry Miller Lite http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926182 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926182 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 21:05:46 -0800 Comment by Jubilation T. Cornball @22: When Stickleys Attack!!!

Woot! You go gurl -- three Maybecks up!!!

]]> Jubilation T. Cornball http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926389 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926389 Boom Tue, 05 Feb 2008 22:59:58 -0800 Comment by non sequitur Another store to compete with QFC at Stone & 40th would be awesome (also closer, so I'm biased). However, that design is rather depressing.

I live in a 1922 "Bungalow" I'm not sure if it was a kit home or development project of its time (there are several similar homes in the neighborhood). I love it and while not a true "craftsman" it is much nicer than the town-homes I've seen.

PS: Mr. Poe, I've finally posted something on here!

]]> non sequitur http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926480 http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/02/northern_exposure#c926480 Boom Wed, 06 Feb 2008 00:45:07 -0800