Slog - Comments on Sweeney Todd's London http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london Tim Burton's new film has few minor problems in the historical accuracy department. Londoners have noted that Big Ben, pictured in the above publicity still, wasn't constructed until 1856. Which would be roughly fifty years after Tim Burton's new film is set. But Big Ben isn't in the film, just this one publicity image, which was pulled after the the inaccuracy was brought to the attention of the filmmakers. But the film opens with a shot of a ship sailing up (or down?) the River Thames--right under a "not fully finished" Tower Bridge, according to the book about the... Copyright 2008 Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:30:24 -0800 Fri, 14 Dec 2007 09:31:07 -0800 http://www.movabletype.org/?v=3.34 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Comment by NapoleonXIV The fashion is way too anachronistic for 1800.

]]> NapoleonXIV http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873806 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873806 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:40:49 -0800 Comment by boxofbirds Since when were musicals supposed to be historically accurate?

I bet that the real French revolutionaries never fake-marched in a perfect V-formation, but that doesn't make Les Mis any less of a good show.

]]> boxofbirds http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873807 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873807 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:41:02 -0800 Comment by Fnarf Geez, Dan, you can pull up a map of London online in about three seconds. The answer is yes, St. Paul's is upstream from Tower Bridge.

At the time the movie was set, I think there was only one bridge across the Thames, London Bridge, the original medieval one, not the one that's there now or even the John Rennie replacement, which might have been in construction then -- maybe THAT'S what they meant?

No, I see that Westminster Bridge would have been built by then. Again, not the one that's there now.

]]> Fnarf http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873808 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873808 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:42:01 -0800 Comment by Bellevue Ave I suppose next you're going to tell us johnny depp isnt english. the travesty!

]]> Bellevue Ave http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873819 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873819 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:45:26 -0800 Comment by boomer in NYC Also--and brace yourselves for this one--chipmunks do not sing!

I know!

]]> boomer in NYC http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873822 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873822 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:46:40 -0800 Comment by COMTE In any case, it's somewhat unlikely that a fully-rigged sailing ship would have ventured quite that far up the Thames, since the main dockyards for London were located a little more than a mile downriver at Wapping.

]]> COMTE http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873823 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873823 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:46:52 -0800 Comment by Ziggity I've always wanted to comment in the goofs section of movies like Harry Potter, saying "Magic doesn't exist." I don't really see how different that is from an anachronism - don't people randomly and publicly burst into song in this movie?

]]> Ziggity http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873826 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873826 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:47:38 -0800 Comment by Fnarf Yikes. Yes, that's true. Couldn't get past the bridges.

]]> Fnarf http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873829 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873829 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:48:25 -0800 Comment by NapoleonXIV @5--if you squeeze them hard enough, they'll sing.

Trust me.

]]> NapoleonXIV http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873830 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873830 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:49:09 -0800 Comment by Dan Savage Hey, they pulled the ad with Big Ben in it, they didn't say, "Hey, this is a musical, people!" So... I thought I'd point this out.

]]> Dan Savage http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873838 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873838 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:50:44 -0800 Comment by Perfect Voter C'mon, Big Ben is the name of the main bell inside the clock tower, it's NOT the name of the tower itself.

]]> Perfect Voter http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873850 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873850 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:57:26 -0800 Comment by RHETT ORACLE I thought it was Big Sven...!

]]> RHETT ORACLE http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873859 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873859 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:06:24 -0800 Comment by Malcolm in Sydney @11 As a fellow Pedant, I can only say "Thank You"

]]> Malcolm in Sydney http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873860 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873860 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:07:09 -0800 Comment by MARIAN THE WIKIPEDIA LIBRARIAN Further search reveals a plethora of information about Sweeney Todd both in fiction and non-. Enjoy. As for anachronisms, watches and sunglasses were noted in the throngs of Romans attending the chariot race in "Ben-Hur" - so Big Ben /Clock Tower - not so much...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweeney_Todd

]]> MARIAN THE WIKIPEDIA LIBRARIAN http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873870 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873870 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:12:36 -0800 Comment by Lake Dan, that could be the first of the errors section at IMDB.com.

The trivia is already pretty good

]]> Lake http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873877 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873877 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:24:30 -0800 Comment by Jiberish my expertise lies north of the humber

]]> Jiberish http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873884 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873884 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:31:05 -0800 Comment by jkluska As the costumes and production design indicate, this film obviously isn't set in 1800...more likely it's set sometime in the late 1840s or early 1850s.
(Sweeney Todd as we know him is largely a fictional creation, popularized in 1846 publication entitled "The String of Pearls: A Romance"...the movie seems to reflect this version of the character).

]]> jkluska http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873888 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873888 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 17:40:46 -0800 Comment by Will in Seattle All in all, it was fairly good.

Still a wonderful film, deserving of its many nominations.

]]> Will in Seattle http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873901 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873901 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 18:00:52 -0800 Comment by glendaleted This is Tim Burton. It's all about the look. To hell with everything else, e.g coherent stories, compelling plots, etc.

Yeah, I'll see it. Hopefully it won't suck *ss as bad as PLANET OF THE APES did.

]]> glendaleted http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873903 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873903 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 18:03:59 -0800 Comment by JayHoytt Have to admit I chuckled as well to see such an attempt at pendantry (if you will allow the word) foiled by it's own inaccuracy. Big Ben != Clock Tower.

BTW: Not to be repetitive, but rumor has it that S. Toddd *did not exist at all*. And if he did, there is no evidence that he routinely burst into song.

These revelations should be sufficient to undermine any plans educators have for using *Sweeney Todd* as a historical text.

]]> JayHoytt http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873926 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873926 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 18:34:32 -0800 Comment by Dan Savage Damn you, JayHoytt!

]]> Dan Savage http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873933 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873933 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 18:40:07 -0800 Comment by Chaucer I haven't seen the images of the ship in question, but tall ships couldn't sail up the Thames as far as the Bridge. There are smallish waterfalls (probably gone, now) that impede their passage. The closest they could get was Rotherhithe, which in 1800 was outside the city.

]]> Chaucer http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873943 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873943 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 18:56:34 -0800 Comment by Henrietta Are you sure? The direction of the Thames changes with the tide. I've seen it with my own eyes.


Also, a whale recently got lost up in it and was seen near the tower "formerly known as Big Ben". How'd that bloody whale make it up the waterfalls?

]]> Henrietta http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873954 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873954 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 19:31:26 -0800 Comment by Cale yeah and people keep breaking out into song? what's up with that man? did people even DO that in the 1800's??

sheesh.

]]> Cale http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873975 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873975 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 20:46:19 -0800 Comment by Fnarf Good point, Cale. People in the 1800s broke out in OPEN SORES.

]]> Fnarf http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873994 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873994 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 21:18:51 -0800 Comment by Mike Friedman None of this matters.....It's only the best musical ever written.....I absolutely can't wait.

I saw the recent Broadway staging twice (once in New York and this past fall in SF) and it was once again amazing.

I've always thought that it was probably set in the 1830s or 40s, when London was the largest and filthiest city in Europe (and maybe the world).....

As a singer eons ago, I have to say being in this show was the highlight of my experience in theater. My voice never sounded better before or after that show (in 1983!) Sondheim does not write music that is easy.

]]> Mike Friedman http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873996 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c873996 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 21:22:04 -0800 Comment by Malcolm in Sydney As a resident of the city where Stephen Sondheim sent Sweeney, I would like to chime in (pun intended) with some information to assist in this discussion. Transportation to the colony of New South Wales was officially abolished on 1 October 1850.

Sweeney would have to have been sent here prior to that (ie soimetime in the mid 1830s at the very latest).

I have seen it twice in the Sydney Opera House, which is not too far from where the (entirely fictional) Benjamin Barker would have been disembarked in irons.

]]> Malcolm in Sydney http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c874009 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c874009 Arts Thu, 13 Dec 2007 21:46:14 -0800 Comment by UNPAID BLOGGER Thats it... no Oscar for you.

]]> UNPAID BLOGGER http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c874139 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c874139 Arts Fri, 14 Dec 2007 08:38:05 -0800 Comment by michael strangeways huh? I think Sondheim's Sweeney Todd is set in mid Victorian London and is told in the style of the penny dreadfuls of the period.

]]> michael strangeways http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c874178 http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/12/sweeney_todds_london#c874178 Arts Fri, 14 Dec 2007 09:31:07 -0800