"I guess I should feel guilty that I killed the LGBT Center by spending $10k on bringing Z-list celebrity Reichen Leikmukl to be the guest speaker at Fruitbowl and for spending thousands and thousands of dollars on idiotic Queerfest which was a huge boring boondoggle and caused huge divides in the community and ended up $30k in debt and for shittily running the Center for the last 3 years and not doing my job and raising money instead of spending it and running the place like a Ladies aid society in Waco and letting the center website collapse so that there wasn't a website for 6 months and generally doing a crappy job, backed by an idiotic do nothing board of directors, and then skipping out before the whole thing crashed in an effort to avoid being blamed for the whole mess, but guess what, I don't."

I'm not surprised. As as organization, they've done approximately nothing.

There are 56,000 millionaires in King County and raising money from the LGBT community isn’t that difficult--just ask Jaime Peterson. Anyone who says “It’s tough all around for nonprofits” is just trying to hide their own ineffectiveness; especially because an ED’s primary responsibility is keeping the nonprofit financially viable.

The need for Gay/Lesbian/Bi organizations has passed.

@4 I'd disagree with that. It's just that we're savvy enough in Seattle to know which ones to support. There aren't reports of Equal Rights Washington, Lambda Legal, SEAMEC, Lambert House, Seattle Men's Chorus or the like laying people off or moving to cheaper locations, because all of those organizations are effective at providing the services they're supposed to, such as political organization, legal aide for GBLT causes, GBLT youth support, and shitty choral music.

If the LGBT Center had provided a host of popular community events instead of blowing cash on bullshit, then I think things might have turned out differently.

@4: Actually, its needed more than ever. There needs to be a place where the micro organizations can flourish, as well as general meeting space and a place that coordinates what's going on in the broader community.

Bygones should be bygones. Shannon's gone, and while she and I have had our differences, a discussion needs to occur as to how to move things forward.

There's a new ED and I'm hopeful he'll get the ship uprighted. But he'll need help and I gotta say that is going to have to come from a broad spectrum of the community.

It's embarrassing that the #2 city in the country in percentage of identified GLBT residents can put up these stats:

Number of low income LGBT housing: Zippo.
Number of LGBT at risk youth beds: Zippo.
Annual budget of center: About 300K.
Annual budget of Denver's ctr: 1.2 million
Assets of Seattle's Center less liab: Assets of San Diego's Ctr less liab: 1.5 million

Instead of handwringing, there's work to be done. It's going to take the cooperation of the community, individuals, politicians and the like to make it happen. But it needs to happen.

The city and state in particular should be a part of making investment into the community. Where are they? Nowhere. Making sure kids have a place to turn for info or meeting space for little non-profits that do other things in the community seems to me to be a priority over the neat streetcar we got. Or maybe we should just put our elderly and kids on the SLUT and let them run back and forth.

That should have been

Assets of Seattle's center - under 100K

Assets of SD's center- 1.4 mil.

Most of the other similarly situated city (ie Minneapolis, Milwaukee, Atlanta) post greater community support and involvement.

And for those of you that want to lob bombs with out getting off your ass to help out: Shame on you. Get involved. Do something.

Gitai, I think your heart is in the right place but an LGBT center isn't supposed to be solely a Social organizition. They should provide information and services for the community. Sadly, the Center is failing on both counts due to a history of mismanagement. (but not from the current interim director Dennis Poplin and center coordinator Anna Bacler who are hard working dedicated people who have been desperately trying to keep the Center together for the last few months since a certain former director fled the scene). And the Center DOES do some good work and it IS used by members of the community. The Ingersoll Gender Center is a vital resource for the trans community. The Resource and Referral Line does provide vital information for members of the greater LGBTQ community. QArts is the arts organization that I chair at the Center that manages to draw in over a 100 people for the bigger art receptions, on NO budget and paid advertising but a lot of hard work from volunteers. I've been working my butt off trying to build QArts into a viable arts organization that has some interest and some edge to it, and not just for the LGBTQ community but everyone interested in the arts in Seattle. So, please don't negate the hard work and good intentions of a few dedicated people because of the actions or inactions of a few.

and thank you Dave Coffman for those stats and information. This mess isn't solely the fault of the former director, or the Board or certain individuals that may or may not have contributed to all this shit. There has to be some finger pointing at the community at large, (and not just the LGBTQ community) for constantly bitching about this city wide problem or that one but failing to do much of anything about FIXING the problem. It's fun to bitch about the Center, or lameass gay pride, or crappy mass transit or developers running amuck but it's not so much fun to haul your ass out of the coffee shop and away from your laptop to do anything about it.

Thanks Michael for the great QArts shows I have seen throughout the years. The art is truly for the community. I don’t want to see this go away.

The Center still houses the office for Ingersoll Gender Center. They do great work!

My organization - ACTION NW - had our first office there. We moved our office when GCSS , our then fiscal sponsor, was dissolved into the Center. What will happen to all these organizations if the Center closes up? We had to seek out a new fiscal sponsor.

The Center also has a monthly police advisory meeting to address community issues. The ones I have been to have been very informative. They are open to the public and you bring up issues that are important to you.

Although, the former ED failed to make this a financial viable organization, we must now strive to make this a success.

There is real need for The Center. We just do not know it because it never really had a vibrant presence. Michael is correct in the community's attitude. I see the same people Michael Strangeway sees sipping on their lattes and tapping at their laptops. I never see them out in the community at art functions, forums (like the one at BPW last week) and other community events. The people I do see out are working hard because they love this community and want to see it succeed in every aspect.

@8 Is there really a need for an informational service when the Internet exists?

And while the individual organizations you mentioned may be functional, is there the need for a dedicated community center for them? And should the community dedicate money to maintaining permanent office space in a dedicated location rather than putting that money toward an endowment that could build the facilities Coffman is talking about?

Gitai: Yes, there is. The Center has a computer center which consists of ONE computer which is in almost constant use from people who come in who don't have access to a computer. People like to believe that everyone and their cousin owns their own computer, but that is NOT the case. Millions of people do NOT have access to a computer at home, and for people who do have access to a computer at work or wish to use a free computer in a public library, that isn't a very safe place to research LGBT issues. We like to think that everyone in the greater Seattle area is a big liberal, but how many employers would be happy with employees who are researching their gender identity or issues with coming out, on company time? And what about closeted people who don't feel safe or comfortable researching things at home where Mom, or your spouse or your kids or your roommate might find out what you've been researching? And no, I"m not talking about closet cases trying to get laid on the Internet; I'm talking about people doing legitimate research on LGBTQ issues.

And your latter comment makes no sense. Mr Coffman proposed there should be money for a faciltiy for the community...uh, that's what the Center is, a facility for the communty and a space for even smaller but still important and vital groups to organize and meet. And it IS needed whether or not you think so.

The Center did nothing ey??

How about the hundreds of people the Center and it's wonderful volunteers have assisted, whether out of town, needing resource assistance, finding support groups, etc... A lot of the people who have stepped into the other organizations, such as Verbena, Gay City, LifeLong, Lambda Legal, ended up their because of the referral of the Center.

And how about the ever amazing QArts Program, which through the years has turned out exceptional queer art shows due to hours and hours of hard volunteer work, giving exposure and pride to the LGBTQ arts community?

How about helping both Bent Writing Institute and Equal Rights Washington get their 501c3 rating?

It is easy to bitch behind that computer and criticize isnt it?? This is exactly what is wrong with this picture. Much bitching and no love or support. It extremely saddens me, that a population already so oppressed and vulnerable, especially during this time of heightened malicious crimes and hate crimes against our community, we step this low and turn on our own.

It's all Mark Mom Finley (s) fault you know... Once they got him to host and march in their parade it was all down hill from there... Everything Finley touches becomes cursed and doomed for failure... Anyone remember that queer night club Safari? The Yo Mom column in SGN? Thursday night at Neighbors? Etc. etc. and so on and so forth... D'ya hear that pride parade planners?

yeah, I think 'mom' was also responsible for the Edsel, the Holocaust and that damn Caveman tv show...

give it a fuckin' rest, man...

@13 I'll say it again. If it was doing work that was valuable to the community, the community would support it, just like the community supports all those other organizations.

Gitai, you are an idiot.

Your logic is beyond wonky. You're saying that good work isn't valid and necessary if it goes unrecognized and under appreciated.

I repeat, you are an idiot.

Seems to me, Strangeways, your attitude is part of the problem. By refusing to hear what the community is saying about its wants and needs you are doing a disservice the to the Center that you love. It doesnt matter if you get 100 people to show up at an art show if the organization cannot pay its bills. Fiscal responsibility is directly tied to responding to the communities needs and desires. Sounds like youre not listening. Here's hoping the new ED is...

Um, about all these other super successful organizations that serve the gay community, Gitai, you seem to have a pretty broad brush.

ERW is an organization that has shown great promise, has done some great things but is TOTALLY unstable both financially and organizationally. Their mission is dictated by a few loudmouths who themselves have barely done a thing to raise money for the flailing org -- let alone take the time to actually ask the community wants from it's premiere rights organization.

Should they be circling the drain like the center?

I've given them money in the past but never again. They only reach out to me when they're running out of cash. As for the center, I used to give them money too but they just forgot to keep asking.

Each org still has a mission to complete so I'm open to them surviving -- but it's not so simple as you put it.

Um, about all these other super successful organizations that serve the gay community, Gitai, you seem to have a pretty broad brush.

ERW is an organization that has shown great promise, has done some great things but is TOTALLY unstable both financially and organizationally. Their mission is dictated by a few loudmouths who themselves have barely done a thing to raise money for the flailing org -- let alone take the time to actually ask the community wants from it's premiere rights organization.

Should they be circling the drain like the center?

I've given them money in the past but never again. They only reach out to me when they're running out of cash. As for the center, I used to give them money too but they just forgot to keep asking.

Each org still has a mission to complete so I'm open to them surviving -- but it's not so simple as you put it.

Um, about all these other super successful organizations that serve the gay community, Gitai, you seem to have a pretty broad brush.

ERW is an organization that has shown great promise, has done some great things but is TOTALLY unstable both financially and organizationally. Their mission is dictated by a few loudmouths who themselves have barely done a thing to raise money for the flailing org -- let alone take the time to actually ask the community wants from it's premiere rights organization.

Should they be circling the drain like the center?

I've given them money in the past but never again. They only reach out to me when they're running out of cash. As for the center, I used to give them money too but they just forgot to keep asking.

Each org still has a mission to complete so I'm open to them surviving -- but it's not so simple as you put it.

Um, about all these other super successful organizations that serve the gay community, Gitai, you seem to have a pretty broad brush.

ERW is an organization that has shown great promise, has done some great things but is TOTALLY unstable both financially and organizationally. Their mission is dictated by a few loudmouths who themselves have barely done a thing to raise money for the flailing org -- let alone take the time to actually ask the community wants from it's premiere rights organization.

Should they be circling the drain like the center?

I've given them money in the past but never again. They only reach out to me when they're running out of cash. As for the center, I used to give them money too but they just forgot to keep asking.

Each org still has a mission to complete so I'm open to them surviving -- but it's not so simple as you put it.

Um, about all these other super successful organizations that serve the gay community, Gitai, you seem to have a pretty broad brush.

ERW is an organization that has shown great promise, has done some great things but is TOTALLY unstable both financially and organizationally. Their mission is dictated by a few loudmouths who themselves have barely done a thing to raise money for the flailing org -- let alone take the time to actually ask the community wants from it's premiere rights organization.

Should they be circling the drain like the center?

I've given them money in the past but never again. They only reach out to me when they're running out of cash. As for the center, I used to give them money too but they just forgot to keep asking.

Each org still has a mission to complete so I'm open to them surviving -- but it's not so simple as you put it.

what have I gotten out of the LGBT Community Center? Glad you (really didn't)ask me:

1) A space to stay connected to community when my partner and I were homeless after I went through job discrimination because of being trans. People there made sure I didn't fall off the face of the planet.

2) Advice from some activists about angles for projects I was doing. Whether I followed it or not, I got more ideas.

3) A space to have meetings on a limited budget (my own pocket) because I don't belong to any one organization.

4) I killed time there with other activists in between events.

5) I job searched there on that lone computer when I was homeless.

There are many other things that I have given and gotten from that space. I helped with the renovations, and would hate to see it close down.

I think there's some serious class issues going on here in this debate. Us poor/low-income queer folks need this center a lot more than the queer folks with money realize, because you all don't really see us.

Lincoln