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Break up now, have time to get over him, then move.

If he can't understand that the place you're living is killing you, he's not the right guy.

You must do whatever it takes to get yourself happy, and if that's never going to occur in Seattle, and he's never going to leave....well, the math kinda does itself, doesn't it?

Posted by el ganador | December 12, 2007 3:21 PM

that's a risk we all take when moving to a long-term relationship. just be honest -- what more can you do? require a deposit?

Posted by infrequent | December 12, 2007 3:22 PM

Just move. He'll either move or he won't, and that's what you really want to know. Just move.

Posted by Carollani | December 12, 2007 3:23 PM

Hell, wait and see if he moves with you. What's it matter if you have a broken heart in seattle or somewhere else?

Posted by idaho | December 12, 2007 3:26 PM

Summer is still months away. Also, if it's the cold and the gray that she doesn't like, shouldn't she leave at the END of summer, if possible? Depending on when the move takes place, there are 6-8 months before then.

I think it would be foolhardy to up and break off a relationship she's so happy in. Just like most relationship logistics, communication is the answer here. She should ask her boyfriend to seriously think it over for the next few months, and explain why she wouldn't want to wait until the last minute. Let's say she gives him until the first day of spring. Until March 21st, they can keep having the wonderful relationship they have, and not focus on the impending summer move and what it will bring, because 1) it will be resolved by then and 2) letting him think about how great they are together (or otherwise) will come a lot easier without a verbal reassessment between them along the way. Just put it out there, enjoy at least a few more months of a good thing, and if it have to ends there will be plenty of time to do so and bounce back with the warming weather.

Posted by Graham | December 12, 2007 3:28 PM

Buy a sunlamp and have sex underneath it

Posted by vooodooo84 | December 12, 2007 3:28 PM

Break up with him now. Then, he can find a girl who loves him AND rain, and you can move to a sunny town where people are open and friendly. Also, since they'll be so outgoing, you'll have better chances of meeting a new guy. Win!

Just make sure you love the new digs before you date again. Being dumped because of a disagreeable climate sucks ass.

Posted by Gloria | December 12, 2007 3:28 PM

What kind of person leaves Seattle in the summer?!? Seattle is AWESOME in the summer leave now or leave next fall, but if you leave in the summer, you're nuts.

BTW saying everyone else is cold and isolated is kind of like saying everyone else is crazy. Might want to take a closer look at your demeanor and actions before blaming the roughly 600,000 people living in Seattle for your misery.

Posted by No-name | December 12, 2007 3:32 PM

Don't leave! I mean, we now have a SLUT running. ;_;

(ok ok, pretty much what everyone above said.)

Posted by matthew fisher wilder | December 12, 2007 3:32 PM

@8's latter point is completely correct by the way.

Posted by matthew fisher wilder | December 12, 2007 3:35 PM

Winter is awful in Seattle. It's not life-threatening, but the gray and the cold do hurt the soul. But the summers! Pure nature's glory; the best in the world. Last summer was nothing to write home about. It was an off year. Wait for this summer before deciding to move. You may fall in love with our beautiful city again.

Posted by josef | December 12, 2007 3:35 PM

Is it really that hard to say "No, seriously, I'm really going to move, and I need to know now whether you will start actively preparing for that or not"?

Well, actually, yeah, it might be. But she still needs to say it.

Posted by tsm | December 12, 2007 3:35 PM

Also, I don't see why starting a new life in a new city (newsflash: apathy is a fact of urban life in many places, so do your research) with a broken heart should be that bad. It sucks, but what about him? If he leaves, he loses all his friends and family; if he stays in Seattle, he's constantly reminded of what exactly drove his girlfriend away.

Posted by Gloria | December 12, 2007 3:35 PM

If she's been here for a year and a half, she's seen a Seattle summer already. No hope in convincing her, folks.

Posted by matthew fisher wilder | December 12, 2007 3:37 PM

@13:if he stays in Seattle, he's constantly reminded of what exactly drove his girlfriend away.

Playing D's A, he might end up relieved.

Posted by matthew fisher wilder | December 12, 2007 3:38 PM

Dump him and get out. FNG.

Posted by Lesser Seattle | December 12, 2007 3:46 PM

@15: That is true.

But if he isn't, he can stand outside every time it drizzles and cry under the clouds (and the tears will mingle with the rain on his cheeks!). It's the ultimate pathetic fallacy. For this alone, I hope he decides not to move and forces her to break up with him.

Posted by Gloria | December 12, 2007 3:46 PM

How does she even know they will still be together by the summer?
Don't blame her for leaving. Wish I had that luxury. Stuck here in the miserable rain with all you miserable unfriendly people.

Posted by max | December 12, 2007 3:48 PM

@14... Last summer was hardly summer.

Posted by John | December 12, 2007 3:49 PM

I know from experience that your first winter in Seattle is the worst, in a make-you-want-to-die kind of way, but it does get better. That aside, I wouldn't say that him not telling his friends and family that he might move is that good of an indicator one way or the other, but if she's considering breaking it off now because of it, he has a right to know that that's a factor. So more or less I agree with everyone else on this thread, and I have the same reaction I often have to Savage Love letters: Don't tell Dan, tell your man!

Posted by hillside_hoyden | December 12, 2007 3:49 PM


Posted by Mr. Poe | December 12, 2007 3:50 PM

I'm gonna go ahead and second the "sunlamp + sex" suggestion, or at least the sunlamp part. On the off chance that you're just having a severe emotional reaction to lack of vitamin D...isn't that at least worth trying?

And most of the time, the people who claim everyone here is "cold and isolated" aren't very friendly or open themselves. I'm just saying, whenever you point a finger at someone there's four other fingers pointing back at you.

Posted by Hernandez | December 12, 2007 3:51 PM

Take it a day at a time. No, he might not want to move immediately. Ever hear of a long distance relationship? A year apart feels awful, but it isn't actually all that bad. You talk every day on the phone, try to see each other once a month, and then maybe you assess if this is what you WANT for life, and he moves.

Posted by arduous | December 12, 2007 3:54 PM

Leave Seattle. Leave the boyfriend. Or don't. Whatever. But leave Seattle. Our beautiful city isn't for the fairhearted. It's beauty and riches are reserved only for those bad-assed enough to handle the bad with good.

I hear Portland is accepting new citizens.

Posted by Brad | December 12, 2007 3:57 PM

@22 - Also it takes 37 muscles to frown and 22 muscles to smile.

Posted by kid icarus | December 12, 2007 3:59 PM

Depends on where she's going. If Montreal (like a certain person I know), she'll probably be fine. If you're moving from Seattle to Vancouver BC ... um, it gets grey there too.

Is it semi-commutable? A good bf would consider flying to SF if there was anything there ... or Spokane or Portland. And they have cheap flights to NYC.

Posted by Will in Seattle | December 12, 2007 3:59 PM

@26: I wonder if she's sensitive to other weather as well. She doesn't like rain and clouds, but is she going to like ice and snow any better? I personally find little more miserable than having to climb an incline in February -- against the wind.

Also, French people. Not saying they're cold and isolated ... but you know. It's a possibility.

It's gotta be south if she's going anywhere.

Posted by Gloria | December 12, 2007 4:03 PM

Get a sunlamp and go for a walk. Then give him a big sit-down talk about Where We Are Going (Or Not). If he's in, then you have more options for housing. If not, you need to know now so you can plan ahead for it. And if he's in, he needs to tell people NOW so they can start dealing with it.

One of my best friends just moved back to FL after spending 7+ years up here. She never tired of bitching about the same things: the weather, the people, the winters.

However, NRT might want to think about this: aforementioned friend is now back in her beloved FL, miserable because she knows nobody except her parents and husband, complaining about how it's 80 all the time, and surrounded by rednecks. All her friends live up here and can't afford to fly to her.

Posted by Jessica | December 12, 2007 4:05 PM

I think if you and him continue to get close, love each other and have sex like everyone dreams about, then the painful move will at least be accompanied by the remarkable feeling that someone thinks you're fucking amazing. You could have six incredible months that might leave a positive mark on you forever.

As the move approaches, you should definitely communicate about it. Maybe he'd be more into moving to Austin than NYC, or whatever.

If you two continue getting close and maybe he begins to believe there's stuff to experience in the US besides Seattle, maybe it'll work out. If he doesn't move with you, then at least you spent a good chunk of your best days with someone you think is wonderful.

Plus, if you think Seattle blows now, I bet it's quite a bit worse when you're not routinely getting laid.

Posted by bellevue & belmont | December 12, 2007 4:05 PM

25? Quit being a coward at love. Take your lumps.

Give it a chance. If he doesn't want to move, then bounce on his ass and find someone new wherever you go. If you try out new cities, you can try out new men.

What's with all this trying to get through life unscathed? Don't stress. There's plenty more asskickings and broken hearts in store for this life time. Stand them with the your legs under you and whenever you can, give some back.

Posted by Ask Me Anything, I Listen To Rap | December 12, 2007 4:08 PM

It's not that people are cold...they're just damn cliquey and introverted. It took me as long as she's lived here just to suss out where to find queer geeks with social skills that I wanted to hang out with, since I don't work at Microsoft and all. Now that I've accomplished that though I'm not going anywhere.

Posted by thaumaturgistguy | December 12, 2007 4:09 PM

@31 so true, i have had the same Seattle friends for 15 years and i am only 22

Posted by vooodooo84 | December 12, 2007 4:14 PM

Take a chance, and move. Moving to another city is the best way to get over a broken heart anyways, so if it happens, you're still in the best position possible. You'll be too busy discovering to mope.

If he comes with, you win too.

Posted by Fnarf | December 12, 2007 4:21 PM

What Poe said.

Posted by QuimbyMcF | December 12, 2007 4:26 PM

So I was in Palm Springs for the First time in my life last weekend. It was grey, rainy and cold; the first time in 2 years! The snow line on the mountains was low.

Dumb the BF and move to sunny warm Palm Springs. The people there will be happy to talk with you. They'll think you are their grand-child!

Posted by Sargon Bighorn | December 12, 2007 4:27 PM

Is she kidding? I'd LOVE to live in Seattle!

If she's not happy then she should leave. If he's truly happy there though she can ask but can't expect him to follow.

Posted by Wes | December 12, 2007 4:27 PM

Hey everyone: anybody sez Seattleites are cold -- let's berate them and tell them they're wrong, and its their own fault!

That'll teach 'em to think we're not friendly. Dammit!

We've certainly NEVER heard this from ANYONE else .....

In friendship and welcoming,

Posted by Keep the bastards Out | December 12, 2007 4:38 PM

I hate to be the stodgy, nerdy voice of reason, but if she moved here from a place with a very different climate, she should see her doctor and ask about Seasonal Affective Disorder. It can be pretty easy to treat, but it makes living in place like Seattle really difficult. It makes living in a lot of other places really difficult, too.

If that's not the cause of some of her SADness, then I vote for one last kiss goodbye right before she jumps into her car with all your stuff and ship off. Take several days to drive to wherever she's going, meet new people on the way or stop and stay with friends. getting settled into her new life will keep you busy enough to get over the old guy.

Also, even though I've only lived here for five years, I second the notion of needing some BADASS-ness to live up here. for my part, I'm a bicycle commuter all year long, rain or shine or snow.

Posted by _brian | December 12, 2007 4:43 PM

A new city is the perfect way to get over somebody, in my experience. (Although it has been a while)

So that's convenient and all!

Posted by Lake | December 12, 2007 4:48 PM

Hmmm. He hasn't mentioned anything to his friends or family? He's not moving with you. Dump him.

Also, you're an idiot for moving out of Seattle in the summer. Move if you must, but why leave during the 3 months of spectacular weather that we get? Move now or move next fall.

Also, people are people. Protestations to the contrary, Seattle people aren't all that different than people in a warmer climate. If you think you're going to find dramatically friendlier people somewhere else, you're delusional.

Posted by SDA in SEA | December 12, 2007 4:49 PM

Something you didnt mention is where you're moving to. It has to be on par with seattle, for instance if you're thinking of moving to alabama (an entirely different depression inducing area of it's own) you can't very well expect him to move there-nothing is worth moving to alabama. If you havent decided yet you should discuss it with him, especially if you want to stick with him, he probably has some areas that are simply off limits. And if you're move is a collaborative process it increases your chances of staying together.

Posted by BethBeth | December 12, 2007 5:01 PM

Go away. People who love Seattle's very mild climate are sick of you pansy-ass weather whiners.

Posted by violet black | December 12, 2007 5:04 PM

This is probably a reiteration of all the above, but I feel you should give this great relationship a bit more of a chance by sticking around through the summer. During this time you might meet some of the many warm, friendly non isolated folks (and I agree you should take a closer look at yourself if you think everyone in Seattle is cold and isolated.) If at the end of summer this relationship of yours hasn't progressed, and your heart gets broken, and you move, presumably someplace sunny, what greater balm for your broken heart than the warmth and sun of your preferred climate. And you will know that you gave things in Seattle a proper chance and your relationship as well. What ifs suck.

Posted by merve | December 12, 2007 5:21 PM

Do what you got to do ... but relax and toughen up a bit. Just because a relationship ends doesn't mean it's a failure. Just take the feeling with you ...

And you don't get to take care of anyone else until you take care of yourself.

Posted by OR Matt | December 12, 2007 5:24 PM

Warm(ish) but cloudy winters & fucking glorious summers beat frozen slush misery & humidity every time. And maybe you didn't notice, but there's mountains in every goddamn direction & its fucking beautiful here. The most beatiful city in Murka.

But if you can't take it, get out. Where is it better, LA? Miami? Right.

Besides, there's probably a 1000 "Mr. Rights" for you in 'Murka. Asking someone to leave their hometown is mean. Unless it's Cincinnati. Cincinnati sucks ass.

I would know.

Posted by max solomon | December 12, 2007 5:31 PM

I agree with Max. I lived in Philadelphia for two years and the weather consisted of hot and humid summers to go along with the bitter cold winters.

Posted by Supa | December 12, 2007 5:43 PM

@31:It's not that people are cold...they're just damn cliquey and introverted.

...everywhere in the Western world.

(Although it's more notable in Capitol Hill, which isn't surprising since it's more of a central nightlife spot than an informal making-friends spot.)

Posted by matthew fisher wilder | December 12, 2007 5:54 PM

Leave. And try to take out as many Seattle residents with your U-Haul as you can on your drive outta town.

Posted by Boomer in NYC | December 12, 2007 6:39 PM

You canít imagine being without him but staying is not a possibility. Youíve already made up your mind to move, with or without the amazing wonderful guy, out of a city youíve only lived in for a year and a half. What you didnít say is how long he has lived there? When did you make him aware of your decision to move? Donít be so quick to force him to make a major life decision. Thatís exactly what you are doing by threatening to break up with now just because you donít think heís serious about moving with you since he hasnít mentioned it to his friends and family. While you may be a part of his life, his life may be in Seattle. You are asking him to choose you over his job, friends, family, etc., when you yourself are choosing a different city over him. Is this fair? Maybe he hasnít mentioned it to his inner circle yet because he wants to think things through more or not get anyone riled up yet when the move is so far off.

Youíre not moving till next summer. Give it time and lighten up. Enjoy being with this amazing guy and get some good orgasms out of it. Donít pressure, nag, or obsess as women tend to do. Yes your heart may be broken come summer time but if you dump him now youíll be broken hearted in a city that you hate for no good reason. Whatís better than living in a brand new city to get over a guy? If you end up giving him an ultimatum heíll stay. You two arenít even married and youíre already forcing his hand on some pretty heavy shit. Heíll end up seeing a lifetime of this in the future and run. Or stay as the case may be.

Posted by GirlDuJourToday | December 12, 2007 7:06 PM

Depart from me, ye cursed.

Posted by Kiru Banzai | December 12, 2007 7:43 PM

Doesn't she know that newcomers stick to Seattle like flypaper? If she doesn't want to live here forever, she needs to break up with him now and remain celibate until she moves. Otherwise, she'll get pregnant, and she'll have to stick around, with her only option being to spend weekends in Spokane so Seattle seems cheerful in comparison.

Posted by Gitai | December 12, 2007 8:15 PM

she could move here. i'm in lousville, ky. granted, it's a red state, but we're really nice to new people especially if they move here from a big city (people tend to take it as a compliment or something).

the weather, though, is still iffy; last year we had a storm every single thursday (it seemed like) from april through december. and yet, yesterday in the middle of december while much of the midwest was covered in ice, we had temperatures in the seventies. it's whimsical, which is fun, you just can't plan for it is all i'm saying.

oh, and 45 is right. cincinnati is the absolute worst.

Posted by emily | December 12, 2007 8:22 PM

why are people in seattle so cold? i have heard this so many times. i had planned on transfering out there next summer but i don't want to be surrounded by a bunch of aloof individuals with avoidant personality disorder.

Posted by stuck in florida | December 12, 2007 9:26 PM

Go spend the weekend in Minneapolis in January. Marvelous people, but every goddamn time you walk outside, you're in physical pain. Then come back to Seattle and appreciate what you've got.

Posted by JW | December 12, 2007 9:33 PM

JW, true enough. i'm currently sitting here with my A/C on full blast. normal in december. i've grown to despise hot weather, but i cannot handle months of snow.

Posted by stuck in florida | December 12, 2007 9:44 PM

@53: We're only avoiding people who move here and spend the entire time bitching about how much Seattle sucks, and how (insert former home here) has such better: weather/music/food/prices/people. Nobody likes a whiner.

Posted by Jessica | December 12, 2007 9:46 PM


It's largely due to the fact that nobody in Seattle is getting laid, unless they have ovaries.

The dirty little secret about Seattle is that it's about 75% single guys. Go to a bar? Single guys. A party? Single guys. Dance lessons? Single guys. The ballet? I don't know, but most likely a bunch of single guys who heard it was a good place to meet women.

At the end of the day, this sad state of affairs makes it impossible to make friends here: women are tired of being approached constantly, and do seemingly anything in their power to prevent social interactions with men. Meanwhile, the men are too busy elbowing one another (so that they can win 30 seconds of rejection from the troglodyte in the corner), to make friends with any guy whom they don't already know.

Mix that shit up with 9 months of drizzle and darkness, the asian/norwegian "reserved" culture, an overwhelming number of book and computer nerds, cliquish Stranger-hipsters who are doing their damndest to imitate something they heard about New York or San Francisco on the intarweb, and self-satisfied hippies, and you've got a recipe for World Class social dysfunction...

Posted by A Non Imus | December 13, 2007 12:03 AM

please LEAVE. please also take anyone else that complains about the rain and clouds, with you. I've heard Cali & Arizona are sunny.

Posted by NW is too crowded | December 13, 2007 11:35 AM

Yeah, if you don't like it, leave... THE COUNTRY! SEATTLE A-#1 THE BOMB FOREVER.

As you may have noticed, many people here play defense and refuse to say "You know what, that aspect of our city totally sucks and you can still be my friend".

Most people here are much more cold and judgmental than elsewhere to me. This is the fifth place I've lived (and its my hometown) and coming back after years away was depressing and perplexing for at least the first year. I love many things about this city, but the weather and social culture are things that you can't change.

This was expounded by the fact that I've been in a similar situation for years can honestly say that if you and the man aren't happy in the same place then your relationship is going to get fucking fierce down the road when one of you gets restless and wants to move on. Get it worked out sooner or later, because it won't get better with time.

Posted by Scot | December 13, 2007 2:46 PM

I'll second the possible Seasonal Affective Disorder, but assuming that's not it...

Be honest, tell him you are going to move for sure in...6 months?...whatever you've decided. Tell him you love him and you want him to come with you, but you understand that he likes Seattle, has family here, etc. Tell him that in order for you to plan a move, you need to know if he's coming with you by...May 1st? Or however amount of time you think you need to get a new apartment, pack everything, etc., but give the guy a couple of months to think about it. Then don't bring it up and let him think it over until he's ready to talk about it with you.
Will a guy leave his friends, his family, his job, and a place he likes to live in, all for you? I don't know about your bf, but mine did. Of course, he wouldn't have moved to the rednecked woods of Alabama with me, nor would I have asked him to, but he was willing to drive 3000 miles to SF.
So let him have input on where you go. He might say yes to a west coast city but no to a east coast suburb.

Posted by California Girl | December 13, 2007 3:16 PM

Typically, at the age of 25, where you want to live is more important than the person you are dating, being in love or not. This is possibly true as you get older, but especially true when you're 25 and under and still figuring out what is right for you.

Posted by cigar | December 13, 2007 7:39 PM

61: wish i'd realized that before i moved out here

Posted by frede | December 14, 2007 9:26 AM

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