Our language is still in the fairly early stages of this progression. I look forward to the day when the process is complete and we are all speaking Bizarro language, where everything means the exact opposite of what it seems to be saying.

That would actually be more easily understood than what we have now.

You can't use that argument against them. To them it's a test from God, and a temptation from the devil. They can simply swap 'gay' with 'mass murderer' to make that point. Then they'll throw some more contradicting messages from the Bible at you.

Your last sentence is 100% correct, and Dr. James Dobson himself wouldn't be able to say otherwise.

Conservative Religious Group Comes Out for "Right to Righteous-Indignation"

But I think I have one up on you. When I read the snippet from the article, at first I thought it said:

"...finding that it is possible, through religious MEDICATION, to change one’s sexual orientation."

For a moment I was wondering wth "religious medication" was supposed to be!

That makes me wonder what the school mascot would be...

While I personally don't care if a person chooses or is born gay (since my morality isn't based on religious dogma), its a predictable response from the Anti-Gay Crusade.

I know it shuts some people up to point out that people don't choose their orientation, but this is a battle that will have to be fought eventually. By using the 'born that way' defense, it sidesteps the issue of whether there is anything wrong with it. Which of course there isn't, but that defense is implicitly saying "I can't help the way I am born, so even if you think its wrong, accept me".

Which is noble and good, but it opens up the doors for the attack on whether it matters if you are born that way, gene therapy, etc. One day, the political stance will have to be "I don't care if you think being gay is wrong, you don't get to infringe my rights". But for now, its acceptance.

Any other gay's on here want to try this experiment?

They'd say that's ridiculous, which it is, and just as crazy as praying to be straight.

I'd say David Schmader has pretty effectively covered it.

"I laughed so hard, I literally shat my pants!"

I can't help but ask about the mess whenever someone says something like that.

I think that might be akin to torturing yourself in order to prove that Abu Ghraib was a bad idea.

I mean, I was born into that culture and I have a hard enough time around them, and they aren't even trying to make me fantasize about sucking dick. I can't imagine putting up with that crap voluntarily and *on top of that* having them try to convince me that my sexual orientation was wrong.

On the other hand, if you make the right friends there, you might hook yourself with a large supply of free one pot dinners based on cream of mushroom soup as well as formed jello salads.

And Dan, you had the right idea. They support your right to "determine" that your "self" should be just the way they tell you it should be.

Also, just because these "ex-gays" are actually gay don't think you are off the hook on the cream of mushroom soup. Steeped in the culture, steeped in the food.

I didn't want to have to do this, but I am forced to mention: Cream of Celery soup.

Judaism allows for some Jews to hate gays and try to kill them because in a real religion you allow a wide range of beliefs. Liberal Jews should not criticize ultra-Orthodox Jews who hate gays.

But all Jews must hate Christians and criticize their idiot beliefs.