Comments on Cleaned My Desk This Morning and Found...

Gee Christopher clean your desk! (I bet he was really good looking too!) Now I know what happened to my phone number...lost of Christopher's desk...and lost to the ages.

i guess this is meant to embarrass the guy, cause he wrote something critical of the stranger. as in "what a hypocrite, cause he tried to get an intership there." or maybe the point is that the guy is being vindictive, because they didn't give him an internship? i guess? (since christopher frizelle doesn't explain how it is relevant to post this, one can only guess).

i hardly think this guy is the only young person who has tried to get some crap internship to pad his resume a bit.

"Dan" at Seattlest is so racist I stopped going to that site.

He makes racist comments, people call him out, he defends his commnts. It's pathetic.

Don't believe it Christopher! I'm sure he's been planning this article for months - he just wanted to go undercover as an "intern" to get the inside scoop.

anyone see the roast of flavor flav? the part where jimmy kimmel ripped on the whores from "flavor of love", and they cut to a shot of them flipping him off and talking shit? and then jimmy said, gleefully, "did the whores do something? yeah, that will change peoples impression of you. now where was i before i got interrupted by those whores?"

i'm not making a point, i just found that anecdote on the desk in my mind.

cheers!

@2 exactly

my, what a very rovian thing for you to do christopher. an eye for an eye, right?

For the record, I think Christopher's fashion sense is just marvelous, and own more than a few second-hand ties myself. Not to get too exercised about it, but when a man demeans another man's tie, someone needs to stand up and say, "You...that's...I...you're rude!" Unless it's a fruit or sports tie, because those can go either way.

I hope someone else forwards your email address in a random blog somewhere, Christopher. You creepy asshole.

For the record, my email address is already available online pretty easily.

Yeah, I thought this was a little ... rude to post. Though the cover letter was well-written if waaaaay too long considering it went on for over a page.

Gee, imagine sucking up to a company in a cover letter. You really burned the guy!

How is "The Commitment: Love, Sex, Marriage, and My Family" a raunchy title?

lol @9

and #3... what?

WOW!! I just read Jeremy's post on Seattlest. OUCH!!! Ax most of the Stranger staff? Well, if they use an actual ax I am all for it. You know, for the entertainment value only.

Part of me smells revenge for being stood up by a member of the Stranger staff but there are some interesting points Jeremy brings out that I agree with. The ivory tower comment comes to mind....

His criterion seems to be radicalism -- The Stranger doesn't have enough of it, or something. But isn't that just suggesting that the 1969 version of the alt weekly is the best kind? Isn't that the sort of thinking that's killing the alt weeklies? I don't get it. His piece READS like perceptive writing, but there's nothing there.

@My own comment at #1! OH MY GOD!!! Jeremy is so NOT attractive at ALL!!!! I am so sorry for suggesting he could have been!! My eyes! my eyes!!!

Dog salad.

F'in A, man! The Stranger's just too straight for words. Bring back the Helix!

@2 and 6: You're missing the point. Read it again.

Anyway, here's the Seattlest article in question:

http://seattlest.com/2007/08/21/seattles_mallte.php

Seattlest is a bit like the blog version of Tablet (R.I.P.). I like that it's around, but it's not a veritable third party alt-entity that's making The Stranger or The Seattle Weekly break a sweat.

Nor am I suggesting that being that third player should be their goal. But right now, it seems they want to be something inbetween the two, and are settling for a diluted middle ground, generally speaking. Articles like this make them sound relatively explosive, which isn't saying too much.

I like Seattlest, but the whole [City]-ist family of blogs should be more aggressive in general.

As for Christopher, by posting this, he's just begging for his original resume to The Seattle Weekly to be brought out by the New Times frat boys.

Christopher@19: maybe Jeremy is harshing your mellow because he finally got a clue, perhaps?

I just think it's so lovely how somebody who's trying to break into the professional publishing world as a writer or editor would, in his cover letter, mention that he's hoping to leave behind the crap jobs "and actual become a pro".

Forget the internship--why wouldn't you hire somebody like that straight away? He letter write good!

i wouldn't mind seeing ECB's cover letter from when she applied for (and got!) a job working for the weakly.

A Duel! A Duel! To the death! And the prize shall be relevance.

There appears to be a leak in security in this article--I shouldn't be able to read that "Confidential to Jeremy" statement, should I?

@20, I agree, but who did Christopher have to sleep with to get his job at the Weekly and the the Stranger? We want ALL the dirt!!! And DETAILS!!!!

December 3rd 2006 is more than a couple of months ago. Either a very dirty desk, or everything sent in is kept in the 3rd floor beehive... possibly in a Cheney Man-Safe.

So, yeah, if you ever want a job at the Stranger, just know that they may post your resume online in order to embarrass you.

How is this even approaching acceptable behavior?

Christopher,
Your post is an HR nightmare. What was the purpose? To humiliate? You put a mans email address on a website, when all he did was apply for a job? I don't think this falls under frivolous lawsuits...
(Confidential to Chris: Best of luck to you).

Seems like sour grapes as his article was better than anything you've written in the past year.
Since when is humilating a person who applies for a job OK.
you need to grow the f up.

This guy applied for an internship at the Stranger,
and didn't get one. Then he wrote a long a post to a website attacking the paper--a paper he praised in his application--without disclosing that, uh, he had applied for an internship at this paper without success.

Chris' post is totally legit, and called for.

And for the record: I am not an "aging hipster." I was never hip. In 1985 I was listening to Cats, for crying out loud. Someone that was never X can't be an aging X. Please make a note of it.

\\hip-stur\\n. One who possesses tastes, social attitudes, and opinions deemed cool by the cool. (Note: it is no longer recommended that one use the term \"cool\"; a Hipster would instead say \"deck.\") The Hipster walks among the masses in daily life but is not a part of them and shuns or reduces to kitsch anything held dear by the mainstream. A Hipster ideally possesses no more than 2% body fat.

-The Hipster Handbook, Robert Lanham

I agree with Savage on this one. Ya need full disclosure.

However, Jeremy writes pretty well.

It's apparent from both his Seattlest post and his cover letter than he digs long form.

Jeremy - cover letters should be no longer than a page and perhaps only a few paragraphs. Leave all the crap behind, show off your resume and clips and get'er done.

And if you know that Frizzelle is wearing those ties - damn it man - wear one too at the interview!

Since it's what everyone's discussing now, I'll be happy to agree with Mr. Savage and what I think was the point of Mr. Frizzelle's point in the first place: I didn't disclose that. For full disclosure I should point out that while I never interviewed (nor received any confirmation) from that internship request, I did actually interview for an ad sales position at The Stranger in 2004, if I recall correctly. And I never was hired at the Weekly either for an editorial assistant position under the old management.

That said, if the assumption is I wrote the piece as a back-stabbing attempt to get back at The Stranger, they're wrong. I believe I was harder on Seattle Weekly under new management than the old, people against whom I really can't be said to hold any grudge. I've not gotten a lot of jobs; I can't really hold that against people who didn't hire me (or call me back), and in fact I'm sure Mr. Frizzelle could have found countless examples of worse writing of mine floating around the Net to justify his failure to call me back.

That said, I stand by what I wrote, and clearly I'm not the only one who feels that way. As The Stranger ages and increasingly enjoys the top spot in the local alt-weekly market, they're going to have to remain competitive to stay at the top. How they evolve (or don't evolve) isn't wholly a matter of editorial choice, it's a matter of business direction. That's a reality that exists well outside the ideas floating around my Seattlest post--hence the E&P article I was responding to in the first place.

This was an ugly post intended to embarrass and silence a critic, and Savage's defense of it should embarrass him.

Barker applied for an internship eight months ago, and he wrote the critical post yesterday. If there is no particular connection between the two events--if like a normal person, Barker isn't nursing a series of eight-month-long grudges against every employer who didn't get back to him--then one can conclude that he either changed his mind about the quality of the paper, or even that he was blowing smoke up your asses to get a job. Only the least charitable reading of events makes his application at all relevant to his criticisms.

Attacking his motivations and attempting to embarrass him is a rather poor way of dealing with the criticisms made in the linked article.

Dan, what is wrong with criticizing a publication that the critic once applied for? Seems to be a popular game in the alt-weekly biz -- and also par for the course in business in general.

If the big scandal/accusation here is that Jeremy's piece may have been (gasp!) vengeance for not being accepted as an intern way back when, then -- if not delusional -- that's just fucking petty public bitchslapping on Christopher's part, which, granted, has been made an Olympic sport at the Stranger.

Then again, as much as petty fucking bitchslapping is "legit" i.e. legal, it doesn't usually involve divulging one's email address, so I still call bullshit on Christopher and now you, Dan.

So does this mean that every time Christopher Frizzelle or ECB criticizes the Seattle Weekly, he or she has to disclose that he/she once worked there?

Awesome!

Jeremy's piece strikes me as criticism from someone who (in the case of The Stranger at least) actually has real affection for his target. (He is definitely much harder on the Weekly.)

I agree some and disagree some, but the article is honestly well written.  I think Frizzelle is smart enough to know that linking your own readers to a particularly well-written criticism is not a very effective approach to revenge.

(My point, for those who miss it, is that Frizzelle was not trying for revenge or embarrassment.  He did, however, bring the accusation on himself by being so vague, even in comments.)

I am an HR manager and the Stranger could be open for legal action taken against it. It is unprofessional at the least and would hope that Christopher cleared it with an attorney before posting it.

frizzelle, you're an ass.

All I know is that if I posted on the internet the resume of a job applicant at my work - whether it was meant to humiliate the writer or not - I would have been summarily fired.

"While Arts Editor Christopher Frizelle remains an accomplished writer, he doesn't seem to bother with it much, which is probably why he's earned the enmity of a number of artists in Seattle by taking the Stranger's hipper-than-thou attitude to new heights."

...And here I thought I was the only one.

This is pretty ugly stuff.

The big irony here is that had this been a criticism written by someone at the Weekly and not Seattlest, no one would have noticed. And if so, no one would have defended the Weekly (except The Weekly of course.)

2 minutes on the internet found Dan Savage's home address on capitol hill and weekend home address on vashon island.

is it ok to publish these facts since he doesn't disclose them when he promotes density? i would never, especially since i think it's great his vacation home is walking distance from the ferry.

Damn, Jeremy...
Your post sounds like more of a weenie than Christopher writes.
Stand up for yourself, as many of us have!
Shed the diaper and grow some kahunas!!!

The bigger question to me is... that's a cover letter? It's more than two pages?

If it has more than two pages, it better have cash money stapled to page two and every succeeding page, because I'm not reading it otherwise.

Disclosure: Dan once interviewed me. On tape. In 1996. I'm betting the tape no longer exists.

15. Radicalism isn't imitation, Fnarf. He's advocating taking a new angle on journalism instead of rehashing the same tired storylines, agendas and crap.

So, this letter. I think he makes one great biting point, that this paper just ain't what it's cracked up to be. Maybe it was before, but it's not now.

And for the record, yeah, I think the quality and integrity of this paper, dubious to begin with, is sliding to say the least.

What made the Stranger think it was okay to publish a letter that relates to an intern position in the first place? (Cover letters for any position including interships are considered employement documents and confidential.)

Beyond the pettiness of publishing it the Stranger could be in a cauldron of trouble. Hope they checked with an employment lawyer to make sure they are not going to get screwed.

COMMENT: BREACH OF EMPLOYEE CONFIDENTIALITY: MOVING TOWARD A COMMON-LAW TORT REMEDY

(142 U. Pa. L. Rev. 431)

SUMMARY:
... An employee's personnel file is perhaps more comprehensive and revealing of her life than any other source of information. ... The tort of breach of "confidential relationship" is generally described as consisting of the "unconsented, unprivileged disclosure to a third party of nonpublic information that the defendant has learned within a "confidential relationship." ... For the tort of breach of confidential relationship, a cause of action consists of the "'unconsented, unprivileged disclosure to a third party of nonpublic information that the defendant has learned within a confidential relationship.'" This definition breaks down into four basic elements: (1) the existence of a confidential relationship, (2) disclosure of nonpublic information that the defendant learned within the relationship, (3) disclosure to a third party, and (4) possible defenses, including consent and statutory and public policy privileges. ...

And after that little tid bit. I think I am going to have to pass on commenting on Slog anymore. I just lost all respect for the Stranger.

Seriously.

If you are willing to publish a private document like this, how can I trust that you will not publish a list of nicknames that posted from a given IP address, or posted from a net block owned by a company or person you disagree with? How can I, after reading this post, be reasonably assured that my own privacy is not also in jeopardy and I won't wake up tomorrow to find my private email address (will not be displayed) in a slog post?

@52, There is nothing that is stopping the Stranger from printing it. And given what they have done for "revenge" on this guy. I would bet they will do it again. I always change my Name and make up a fake e-mail address just for that reason.

Could you imagine what they would do to a slogger who publicly spilled some REAL dirt on a member of the Stranger staff?

They still have your IP address and as long as it is stable for a while, they could just get a list of nicknames you've used against that IP address. Better hope you are posting from a coffee shop or the library.

After reading this post, I have zero doubt in my mind that they'd use comments on the slog against people.

Go to proxy.org and enter slog.thestranger.com to view and comment. The IP they log will be the proxy's IP, not your own. The only way they could get your IP would be to demand it from the proxy, which is a drawn out process and would produce inconsistent compliance.

How incredibly rude.

Dan if The Stranger gets into any kind of legal scuffle over this, there are plenty of law firms in town that would back you pro-bono.

There's a war in Iraq, Israel is threatened by Iran and all these Seattle liberals can do is whine about a cover letter posted on the internet. I'd love to defend The Stranger on this one and really give these Seattle liberals something to whine about.

Yeah, I just lost a lot of respect for the stranger, and I think at the same time had the main points of the Seattlest post proven. Christopher's "oh what, you don't *get* it? go read it again" is just laughable. And serious props for highlighting again how political coverage has gone to shit without Sandeep...

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