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What's with all the females though? What kind of 'supposed' sleezy/sex filled gay bar comes fully equiped with fat hipster girls??

Posted by Justard | June 28, 2007 9:30 AM

You start with three. Your first is one of the three. So when the game begins, it goes away, because you're playing with that one.

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 9:38 AM

Mr. Poe blows my mind with his logic.

Sounds like a fun joint. Wish I were there to enjoy it with all of you.

Posted by Boomer in NYC | June 28, 2007 9:44 AM

I have just a few tips for a future sleaze bar in seattle. Less or more diffused light. The spot lights on certain walls that made who ever was standing/sitting their look like some kind of wax figure. Use gels or softer bulbs. Also, less electro and more punk/classic rock. Television, Ramones, maybe Styx if you want an electro vibe.

Posted by Pony Pounder | June 28, 2007 9:44 AM

I totally read that incorrectly. I'm going to go cry and jack off in a corner now.

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 9:51 AM

spell check: It's Joe DAllesandro...and he has his own website at:

he's dreamy...

he IS a Superstar....

Posted by michael strangeways | June 28, 2007 9:51 AM

Justard, you are an asshole.

Posted by It's Mark Mitchell | June 28, 2007 9:53 AM

justard @ #1: that's mean.

joe dallesandro was amazing and seems like he grew up a swell guy.

Posted by josh | June 28, 2007 9:53 AM

1. Fat hipster girls rule seattle nightlife with an iron fist.
2. Less electro, more punk rock is somehow more sleazy? Please tell me there was some patrick cowley played or SF NRG from the early 80s

Posted by Bellevue Ave | June 28, 2007 9:54 AM

I have no issue with women in gay bars. If you're gay and you can't get sleazy if women are around, or looking at you, well, you're just a coward.

Posted by Dan Savage | June 28, 2007 9:59 AM

It wasn't 70's disco or 80's NRG, it was bad 00's electro, when I was listening that is. . . one good thing, though not sleazy, was the air hockey table. I even saw a little argument break out after a loss.

Posted by Timothy Wind | June 28, 2007 10:05 AM

Right-o, Dan.

Mr. Poe--read it in the right way, as I meant it, with total love and respect. It takes a real man to know the intricacies of Miz Pac Man.

Posted by Boomer in NYC | June 28, 2007 10:06 AM

Hey there is a new Red Lobster opening in Tukwila, how come you never cover that? I bet they have a glory hole too!

Posted by Bombs Away | June 28, 2007 10:06 AM

by electro I am assuming you mean "electro made by skinny white people with bad haircuts, not from detroit"

Posted by Bellevue Ave | June 28, 2007 10:07 AM

I'm pooping.

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 10:11 AM

or Italy or Germany or even Toronto.

In other questions. I seem to remember Pony being slag for "cool" or "sexy", such as "He's Pony". Am I making this up? Does anybody else remember this?

Posted by Timothy Wind | June 28, 2007 10:13 AM

what's with all the justard's though? What kind of 'supposed' sleezy/sex filled gay bar comes fully equiped with dumb-ass girl haters??

hopefully there will be a fantastic decadent disco night there soon....

Posted by terry miller | June 28, 2007 10:17 AM

@1: What about un-hip women? I don't own a pair of converse, have big hair, or own any pairs of mantyhose (stretch jeans).

Can I still go? =)

Posted by Original Monique | June 28, 2007 10:20 AM

I was wondering what the hell the deal was with that Ms. Pac Man game! Granted, I was a little bit intoxicated last night, but I was kicking ass for the first few levels, but then I made two bad moves and all of the sudden it was game over?!? Something didn't seem right. Also, I don't know how early you were there, Dan, but by the time I got to it it was tilting with every shift of my wrist.

Posted by Callie | June 28, 2007 10:20 AM

I dont count europe because it's normalcy there.

Posted by Bellevue Ave | June 28, 2007 10:25 AM

Who needs a glory hole, anyway? It's soooo much better when you grip the head. And besides, how do you know it's not a homophobe with a knife on the other end of that wall? RISKY!!!1!

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 10:28 AM

do they have pinball? i seem to remember a slog post a couple of weeks ago that mentioned that there would be pinball!

Posted by fat hipster girl | June 28, 2007 10:29 AM

i kind of like trying to make @2 a response to @1 in my head.

Posted by erin | June 28, 2007 10:33 AM

@1: i wasn't there last night, so that's one fat hipster girl off your list.

you're an idiot.

Posted by kerri harrop | June 28, 2007 10:34 AM

i kind of like trying to make @2 a response to @1 in my head.

Posted by erin | June 28, 2007 10:34 AM

Oooooh, kerri widda burn!

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 10:39 AM

@23 When I read two, I really DID think it was a response to number one at first!

Posted by Callie | June 28, 2007 10:44 AM

those of you who did not go missed the black widow of (free) air hockey. and colt 45 cans in paper bags with straws.

Posted by munch | June 28, 2007 10:48 AM

@25 - Ha! I like it too.

Posted by defman23 | June 28, 2007 10:48 AM

It might as well be. I only dance with fat hipster chicks. They're always fun, anyway. Rock.

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 10:50 AM

So you and your boyfriend left your kid at home with lord knows who and went to yet another bar where you attended to the subtle context of a glorlyhole? Yup, definately makes Gays look like normal families.

Thanks from the heartland brothers. Your making our lives just that much more difficult.

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 10:53 AM

@23 (and 25...?) In my current caffeine-free state, I actually thought that was what was going on for a second.

Posted by Darcy | June 28, 2007 10:55 AM

Ecce, you just haaaaaad to go there, again.

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 10:55 AM

Mr. Poe

Yuppers, and serious as a heart attack.

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 10:58 AM

If you are out and see some really cute guy with his fag hag they are notorious cock blockers. That is why I feel threatened with a bar full of "fat hipster girls."

Posted by Touring | June 28, 2007 11:02 AM

How selfish for parents to take a night out together, away from their child/ren. Especially when one of the two is going to report his or her experience at the destination.

Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 11:03 AM

Blarg Blarg Blarg about Dan being at a bar. I have plenty of relatives that in Iowa that have gotten knocked up, had kids and went out drinking. Difference is they keep reproducing and going on welfare.

Get on that shit if you are so concerned about effective parenting.

Posted by A*ROCK | June 28, 2007 11:06 AM

It appears the glory hole conundrum speaks volumes about Seattle's psychology. Its impracticality indicates that it's not actually supposed to be used, but is just there so the club and patrons can say things like 'Oh, look, this bar has a glory hole! That's SO NEAT and this bar is so neat for having such a provocative feature!'

(not in those exact words, obviously, because that'd be dorky, but you get the idea)

Posted by Gomez | June 28, 2007 11:19 AM

Our son was at the neighbors' house, hanging out with their kids--and we gave them a full report when we got home at the ungodly hour of 10:30 PM. And we're going to return the favor--take their kids for an evening so they can go have a drink.

You know, Ecce, you have strange ideas about gay parenting. We want equal rights and equal treatment, not the right to be on our best behavior at all times. And the bigots that would point to my having a drink to deny you your rights are going to find something to point to even if I stay home night after night, knitting in the kitchen by the fire.

Oh, and tonight I'm interviewing Mike Jones, famous ex-male escort, at Re-bar about his decision to out Ted Haggard, and about his new book, I Had to Say Something.

Mercy! From drinking in bars with glory holes to cavorting with sex workers in under 24 hours! That should put an end to the gay rights movement!

Posted by Dan Savage | June 28, 2007 11:19 AM

What is it you called me last night, Sav-age? A Fish? That's what a girl who hangs around gay bars is?

Posted by Ari Spool | June 28, 2007 11:19 AM

Erin @ 25 - That's great; maybe Ms. Pac-man is the original fat hipster girl

Posted by k. | June 28, 2007 11:23 AM

31. Of course, because every hetero couple who's had a kid never does anything crazy and/or fun with their lives once they've had said kid. You're supposed to shut off the switch on your social life once you have children. (/yes, that was sarcasm)

Please move to Utah, ecce, where life actually resembles your worldview.

Posted by Gomez | June 28, 2007 11:23 AM

Are you sure it's an actual glory hole and not some empty spot where the old plumbing used to be? Is there actually a place to stand in there?

And why are y'all so excited about glory holes anyway? Sure, fun! Let's just keep on spreading teh AIDS! W00t!


Posted by FS | June 28, 2007 11:25 AM

Ari, I pointed out that "fish" was what hateful gay dipshits called women in gay bars back in the bad old days, the era that Pony harkens back to but, thankfully, can't completely revive.

Posted by Dan Savage | June 28, 2007 11:41 AM

My point is that you are a stereotype. The stereotypical gay man that hangs out in bars, loves glory holes, worships cocks, and thinks of nothing but his own genitals. When you have kids, you GROW UP!

Let me be clear, there is NOTHING wrong with going out to a bar or with friends, etc... However, when you hold yourself up as a posterboy for gay equality, and your behavior demonstrates a measure of selfishness and stereotype that many Americans have of gays, then you may want to think about the impact you have on others. MOST gay men are average, hard working joes, who think the idea of a glory hole is as repulsive as strait men do.

And here, I am talking about MEN - ie. with jobs, kids, spouses, responsibility. Not some over privilidged boy toy hanging out on the other end of that glory hole. If you want to be treated with respect by the society at large, then act with a measure of responsibility and think a little further ahead.

Then again, if you like presenting to society that gay parents hang out around glory holes, spend 2/3 of their evenings at bars, etc...then expect the bigotry to continue.

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 11:53 AM

ecce homo, stop being an asswipe.

When someone has a kid, whether they are hetero or homo, they are not required to lock themselves in their home every night for the entire duration of their offspring's childhood.

I've seen no evidence that Dan takes an evening off any more than any other hetero parent. He makes enough money to have a decent home. There are all sorts of stories about vacations and road trips he has taken with his guy and his kid. They go to baseball games together (you couldn't get any more mainstream than that!). They have an ugly crazy little dog to make the kid happy.

Just like heteros, homo parents can utilize relatives, friends, and babysitters to take care of the little ones on occasion so they can have an evening of adult time to themselves. This sounds like entirely healthy parenting to me.

Posted by SDA in SEA | June 28, 2007 11:55 AM


Mike Jones book is really quite terrible. Bad reading, poor writing, and relatively uninteresting.

Its too bad, because it could have been very interesting.

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 11:59 AM

I think a couple posters, Ecce included, are missing the point. Pony is not a real "sleaze" bar. Its glory holes are misplaced. Its porn is photocopied. It has air hockey and Miss Pacman. Unlike a real sleaze bar, say the Eagle, there was no sex happening in a back room. Pony is camp, retro fun.
Dan did not endanger gay rights by taking a night out to a new camp "gay" bar on Capitol Hill.

Posted by Timothy Wind | June 28, 2007 12:10 PM

ecce homo: Give it up and get the fuck away from this blog. Your sad little comments suck. You must be such a depressed little gay man. Do you ever go out and have fun?

If you know so much about parenting WRITE A FUCKING BOOK. You know, like Dan has. But you probably have nothing worth while to say.

I don't think Dan holds himself up as a poster boy for anything. He lets people know what he thinks and if people agree then they respect and look up to him. THEY BUY HIS BOOK AND READ WHAT HE WRITES. Nobody wants to read what you are writing.

Posted by bradlesb | June 28, 2007 12:21 PM

ecce homo, stop. just STOP. Idiocy isn't becoming on you, at all.

A parent, gay or straight, is not some hermetically sealed entity once a child comes into their life.

No, a parent is someone who lives a full and varied life -- with a variety of interests and passions that show their kids that it's important to pursue the things you love to do, to be *alive*, so that when they grow up, they know how to venture out into the world and find their own interests. Dan explained that he and his boyfriend evening came home and recapped what they went to do, which is how a kid gets a view of the larger world as they grow up.

I suspect, by the way that you're responding, that perhaps your parents limited their lives for you. Really think about that, now, as an adult -- wouldn't that be a sad, fruitless thing to do? Yes, kids learn by example, but not in the way you seem to think they do. A kid doesn't specifically think "Hey, dad's gone to a retro gay bar with a gloryhole. I think I'll do that when I grow up." No, he likely thinks "Hey, it must be cool to be a grown-up and do the things you enjoy." If you've got a problem with where Dan went, that's your personal thing. But don't foist it off as a step backward for gays everywhere. It's a night out. Perhaps you need one yourself?

Oh, and note to Justard -- what's the problem? Were the "fat hipster chicks" there having so much fun with the guy you had your eye on that you couldn't catch his attention? That's your problem -- it's not our problem that you're so dull and near-invisible in comparison.

Posted by rlv | June 28, 2007 12:23 PM

I'll spend my money on books about parenting, not books by people using children as an accoutrement.

Kids aren't like your little designer dogs that you walk once a day and keep pinned up in your studio apts. all day long.

How about being a role model for children that isn't self destructive and shallow.

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 12:30 PM

Hmmm... ecce, I think you and the rest of us have a very different idea of what the word "acceptance" and "equality" mean. I don't think there can be a meeting of minds when there's such a fundamental difference in how we define things.

Posted by The Andy | June 28, 2007 12:33 PM

Somebody build this bar:

Where fat un-hipster chicks are always welcome.

Where gay parents of every stripe are always welcome. Straight parents, too.

Where Savage haters and Savage aggrandizers are welcome, if they keep their mouths shut.

Though I do agree--that Mike Jones book totally sucked.

Posted by Boomer in NYC | June 28, 2007 12:38 PM

ecce homo, come clean; you're actually Dan's BF and this is a joke.

Posted by Bellevue Ave | June 28, 2007 12:38 PM

I cannot fucking wait to go to this bar! And when are they going to have Pho Bang there?

Posted by Tiffany | June 28, 2007 1:23 PM

"Fat hipster girls" are like iron traps they let nothing get in or out. Some boys think it is attractive or cool to go with with the "girls" but I find it to be a BIG turnoff. You may say that they probably don't care what anyone thinks as long as they are having fun but I would think it would be pretty hard to hookup with Mr. Right when some hag is hanging off your arm.

Posted by Touring | June 28, 2007 1:48 PM

It's always the "hag" isn't it?

Some people don't go out to hook up.

Some people go out to see their friends and socialize with them.

I think it's probably OK to do either one of these things. And maybe, just maybe, people go out for other reasons as well.

Posted by It's Mark Mitchell | June 28, 2007 2:16 PM

Ecce, if you could collect your crocodile tears onto the pages of your very own book, worrywort narcoleptics everywhere would finally sleep.

Posted by Lloyd Clydesdale | June 28, 2007 2:26 PM

"Styx if you want an electro vibe"


And what about the pinball?!

Posted by Paulus | June 28, 2007 2:27 PM



Posted by Mr. Poe | June 28, 2007 2:42 PM

Kudos to the gay community for creating a place where one can be sleazy in peace. My wife and I, after leaving the kids with grandparents for the evening, had to resort to her dropping to her knees to give me a hummer in one of those "family" restrooms at Fred Meyer. I'd give anything to have a club that catered to our needs that way.

Posted by Smade | June 28, 2007 2:46 PM

ecce homo

you know nothing about dan or his family. you are making a very sad mess of yourself on this blog.

are there no blogs you can infiltrate with your bs where you live? you are so full of shit, it's no surprise it's coming out your fingertips. the crown of thorns you wear is your own lame-ness. how unfortunate for you. and it's ugly as shit too.

trust me, as the guy who takes most of his calls for him at home, 99% of the people who want to reach dan are doing so to thank him for what he does. unfortunately the other 1% are noisy flatualent assholes like yourself.

I just pity you that you have no other cause then selfishly ruining slog with your drama.

change the drugs christ'y, the ones you're on aren't working.

Posted by dan's boyfriend | June 28, 2007 2:58 PM

Terry Miller rules.

Posted by It's Mark Mitchell | June 28, 2007 3:04 PM

"Some people don't go out to hook up. Some people go out to see their friends and socialize with them."
That is the problem with people today and why we need more real places like Pony. Sometimes when I think people want to only appear to be socializing with their friends in order to look sexier but, no, they really only care about socializing with their friends.

Posted by Touring | June 28, 2007 3:13 PM

Thanks honey.

And Ecce? I never held myself up to the be the poster boy for anything. But, hey, like, whatever. I get the sneaking feeling, thought, that if I stayed home every night and comported myself like a good, matronly victorian lady, you would still find something to fault me for. My taste in t-shirts traumatizing the kid? My preference for buttering both sides of my bread imperiling the gains of the gay movement?

La la la. Have a nice day, I'm off. I gotta go home and take care of the kid because the boyfriend has a doctor's appointment. Then, when the boyfriend gets home, I've got a date with an ex-sex worker...

Posted by Dan Savage | June 28, 2007 3:32 PM

LOL!!! Dan's Boyfriend huh? Whatever...

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 3:32 PM

Touring; more meat markets, less socializing.

Posted by Bellevue Ave | June 28, 2007 3:33 PM

ecce homo = troll.

haven't we all learned...don't feed the trolls.

Posted by terry miller | June 28, 2007 3:36 PM

I had no idea that NOT hanging out around glory holes is I thought it was just decent.

And if you don't want to be the poster child of equality, for the love of God, please stop going on CNN, etc... talking about how "all those studies have been debunked".

No offense, but you don't speak for every homo, definately not every homo thats a parent. In fact, you make many of us cringe.

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 3:37 PM

ecce homo, if you really think Dan Savage is harming more than he's helping gay rights, you are unbelievably naive. Go bug somebody who's really cringworthy, jackass.

Posted by Amy Jo | June 28, 2007 4:10 PM

I'm a non-fat hipster girl who frequents gay bars. I'm also bisexual (in the sex with women way, not the girls gone wild way) and therefore I have every right and reason to be in a queer friendly space.

Earth to gay guys: if my gay friend WANTED to sleep/go to the bathroom/go to your car with you, he'd do it. Wild horses couldn't stop a gay guy from fucking another guy if he wanted to. If you feel you're being blocked by a female friend, you're obviously the hag, and you can't blame the girls in the bar for that sad fact.

Posted by Lauren | June 28, 2007 4:19 PM

Lauren, call me old fashion, but I like to talk to a guy a little before I fuck him. Sure wild horses can't stop two gay boys who want to fuck- but a lame hag can sure as hell interrupt the whole I-want-to-see-if-he's-fuckable process.

Let's not forget the true reason some hags are cockblockers- they're secretly in love with their fags, they want to be surrounded by beautiful men, or they don't want to walk home alone. Ditch the former, bring some cab fare for the latter.

Posted by JaemeCallahan | June 28, 2007 5:10 PM

Ecce homo, you miserable hypocrite, how can you pretend to be all upright and moral when you are COMMENT NUMBER 69? Dude! Think of the children!

Posted by Fnarf | June 28, 2007 5:25 PM

Ecce Homo - please just give it a rest.

I've never seen Dan claim to be the end-all, be-all of homos, and I can guarantee you that you are not some Homo Messiah come to teach all of us a lesson about how gay men should behave in order to make our community look more "normal."

That said, I wish Minneapolis had more of a variety of gay bars. The few left (four or five have closed in the last year alone) just don't do it for me. :/

Posted by JD in MPLS | June 28, 2007 5:37 PM

Reading between the lines, Ecce homo isn't uptight about Dan damaging the gay rights movement - he's just plain uptight. Ecce seems to have turned off (or lacked from the beginning) a fun button, and just plain doesn't get it. For the most part, Ecce's just a harmless midwestern 'mo who simply doesn't get how most people live normal lives that include bars and nights out (or, you know...if you're a journalist in the gay community, actually visiting the community you write about) without lacking full love for their kiddos and without harming them - or the gay rights movement.

Attacking Dan and his family, though, is where Ecce goes off the rails. That's where being a harmless midwestern 'mo stops and being a bitchy asshole begins.

So Ecce...seriously, why don't you start a book club or something that you'll understand? It'll probably be good for your blood pressure! *twinkle*

Posted by switzerblog | June 28, 2007 5:45 PM

@75 The *twinkle* really brought that little something extra.

Posted by Darcy | June 28, 2007 5:57 PM

Icky poo. You can bitch about lots of things with Dan--hell, I do it all the time--but lordy, don't ever mess with his family.

Believe me. My mom's Irish, too.

In the meantime--any of you folks ever come to New York, we'll have us some drinks at the Eagle or the new and improved Cock.

Posted by Boomer in NYC | June 28, 2007 6:21 PM

Ecce, shut the fuck up and go live that non-stereotypical homo life you harp about so much. You're the goddamn bigot.

yeah, yeah, don't feed the trolls, I know, but how many times have I do I have to stop reading posts due to Ecce's hatred-filled drivel? Enough already. Sheesh.

And yay Pony & Fat Hags! Now, if we could only get glory holes for women...

Posted by anonymous | June 28, 2007 7:41 PM


Get a life beyond your penis and you MAY understand what I am saying.

Posted by ecce homo | June 28, 2007 9:15 PM

I'm sorry ecce, but you're about to really piss me off. As in, screaming at the laptop pissed. Let me reiterate (which means to tell again, if you don't get the long version) just because someone decides to have a child, does not mean they have to sacrifice their social life in it's entirety. They left their kid in the care of their neighbor, which is more than I can say for my parents who left my ass at home with instructions not to leave the house and that I had better be in bed before eleven, and y'know what? They're straight up, well, heh, straight.

Stereotypical gay? There is no such thing. At all. Ever. For every college girl gone wild, there's a chick up in the library doing her homework. Same applies to gay people, (I should know, I live in the gay mecca of San Fran) show me a cock happy whore, I'll find you one who'll be happy to be in a long term relationship. And fyi, that's, oh, 95% of my gay friends, (one's a complete whore, I won't deny that, but it doesn't also mean he's not a great person).

Besides, Dan (pardon me for taking liberties with your first name) has NEVER held himself up as the gay god of mankind (God forgive me that), he's actually admitted he's not. Pardon me for not actually looking for the evidence, I'm a little too lazy right now.

And his son is NOT AN ACCRUEMENT!!!!!! Goddamn it, you haven't been reading his Slogs enough if you think he doesn't care. And I hate to say it but, he's gay, and he's (somewhat) of a celebrity. How much do you want to bet CPS is on his ass more than it is for most other people?

For everyone that isn't ecce, please forgive the long rant. Oh, and I don't have a dick, so I'm not particularly focused on that.

Posted by Hellion | June 28, 2007 10:39 PM

OK. Here it is.

Ecce Homo is a cockroach, and a senseless one at that. This thing could not make less sense. Regardless of how many times people respond to it with reasonable, simply stated defenses, it will just creep back and somehow make even less sense than before - which was none.

There is only one thing to do: Simply let it scratch and mewl it's way through life. Just don't respond to it in any fashion. EVER. Just stop, disregard, and carry on with whatever it was that you were slogging about.

STOP RESPONDING TO ECCE HOMO, and all will be well.

Dumb fuck.

Posted by k | June 28, 2007 10:47 PM

Pony is the shit. Though I like my porn to stay in the '60s and '70s, I'm pleased to know the attitude of Pony towards aforementioned hipster chicks is far more current. If a cool chick is going to ruin your gay evening out, go to any of the old school "women scare us and aren't welcome" bars up the hill or around the corner.

And Ecce, stop looking for fags in the public eye to speak for your lifestyle! It's yours, and yours alone. Definitely not mine.

Posted by Erik | June 29, 2007 10:15 AM

Speaking as a straight guy, I'm glad we don't have glory holes into the women's bathroom (or women at the far end eager to suck our anonymous dicks.) I would have never gotten married. Or left college. Or gotten a job. I'd still be in that stall today.

Posted by Big Sven | June 29, 2007 2:09 PM

ps- doesn't everyone have 10"+ cocks?

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