Politics Porn Is Abstinence. (I’ll Say.)
posted by on January 25 at 13:33 PM
The 14-year-old girl sitting next to me during the sex-ed hearing kept hurrumphing through her braces during the testimony from advocates of the bill.
It turns out she’s a home-schooled student from Vancouver, Washington, and she came up to Olympia today with an abstinence-only education group called AWARE.
I asked her if I could interview her about the bill, and she seemed happy to do so, but then the program director, Jim Grenfell, said Cassandra wasn’t the best student to talk to, and he offered up 19-year-old public-high-school grad Ric Burleson, from Vancouver.
Burleson, glancing up at Grenfell a bit embarrassed, told me he didn’t have any problems with teaching about condoms, but he didn’t like that condom use and other contraceptive choices had to be taught alongside abstinence. He believed that was a contradiction.
Burleson also referenced a Planned Parenthood primer, Making Sense of Abstinence, and said if sex-ed classes used PP guidelines, it would redefine abstinence. He complained that the PP guide recommended experiencing “sensual pleasure” and “watching porn” as forms of abstinence.
“You can’t just leave it up to the individual to decide what abstinence is,” he said. “That’s like taking the speed limit, and seeing how far you can go above it, and still count it as not speeding.”
I’ll check in with PP about their primer to see if indeed it does define watching porn as a form of abstinence for teens. It seems to me that would be fine given that watching porn doesn’t pop your cherry. Although, it is illegal for teens to buy porn or access it on the net. So, it would be odd for PP to advocate high-school programs that promote porn. (Although, state guidelines certainly aren’t dictated by PP.)
Planned Parenthood was down here, too, and said they’ve done a vote count and the bill is going to finally pass the senate this year, where it has failed to make it out of committee five years running because key Dems have chickened out.
AWARE’s Grenfell had two concerns with the bill. First, he said the bill might force faith-based abstinence-only groups like AWARE—which present in 29 schools statewide—to teach things it doesn’t support, like giving the green light to sexually active teens by teaching about condoms and other contraception.
His second problem with the bill was this: He felt that if schools and parents didn’t approve of the state guidelines (having to teach about condoms, etc., alongside abstinence), then nothing would get taught at all because dissident schools and parents would opt out. “And that’s not healthy for teens,” he said.
Basically, it seems to me, Grenfell is concerned that this bill will put AWARE out of business.
But, sigh, Grenfell is being a bit alarmist, I think. Certainly a requirement that schools include contraception alongside abstinence in sex-ed curricula wouldn’t prevent schools from inviting AWARE to present. I asked Grunfell if he’d be okay with the bill if it specified that the curriculum had to teach all sides—not that a particular group or lesson plan had to cover all sides.
He said it shouldn’t be up to the state to dictate curriculum.
Meanwhile, I have a call into Rep. Hinkle’s (R-13, Ellensburg, Moses Lake) office to see if he got his question answered.
Okay, off to a viaduct hearing where it looks like the mayor’s office—they just showed up here at the campus cafeteria with lots of big charts—is going to defend tunnel lite.
it isn't up to the state to dictate curriculum? then who the hell would do it?
AWARE's web site features some "STD facts" courtesy Grapevine Publications of Boise, Idaho. Appropriately, Grapevine Publications also sells a text book that teaches history "as it was taught in the late 1800's." At least they are consistent.
I thought God created the world in 1896?
Well I am damn proud that my legislators was one of the sponsors.
Nice reporting, Josh. Now don't fuck it up by writing something stupid about the Viaduct.
Favorite quote from AWARE's website:
"Hang with people who share your values. Why put up with the hassle of someone who doesn't agree with you?"
That's how you grow as a person - just insulate yourself from anyone who doesn't "share your values" - makes you into a very well-rounded person!
And Ivan - the viaduct is dumb, and a rebuild is the dumbest thing we could do to this city in the long run. And don't give me any crap about the "view" - you won't have it in a new viaduct.
Hey, save the viaduct comments for later. Keep this post wholesome: teens and sex. And STD's of the industrial revolution.
The righties have a cottage industry down here. I did a Better WHOIS search and then Googled the address--big shock I came up with a "Crisis Pregnancy Center" listing the same address. And you can't do porn (at least in the libraries here) because these people held the new library facility hostage until they got mandatory filtering for everyone, no matter what. So after a kid is knocked up because they don't know what is what, they stumble into the fake clinic and get "help," ie "Christian counseling."
Sorry I don't have time to format this--the first is the WHOIS info, followed by some business directory I found when I googled the resulting address.
__________________________
Registrant:
Aware
5109 E FOURTH PLAIN BLVD
VANCOUVER, WA 98661-6547
US
Domain Name: AWAREPROGRAM.NET
______________________________
Crisis Pregnancy Center of Vancouver
5109 E Fourth Plain Blvd
Vancouver, WA 98661-6547
(360) 699-5433
BS Willis - the Seattle Times thoroughly debunked Tim Ceis' claim that a rebuilt AWV would eliminate the view.
I'd say beggaring the ability of the City to do anything else after 10 years of cost overruns would do me a lot more harm in the mid/long term than a rebuilt AWV would...
Now back to your regularly scheduled ignorance-induced teen pregnancies and STD's...
Cassandra Orefice sounds like a character out of Eugene O'Neill. How do you expect us to go on reading the post after you drop that name?
Did you ask here what she thought of horses, or greeks for that matter?
Eh, I say we just set up an opt in system for abstinence only education. All kids will receive comprehensive sex education, and if you want your kid to be at higher risk of unintendend pregnancy and STDs, you sign them up for the abstinence only class.
Pardon if this is missing a point, but why exactly should I give a fuck if AWARE is put out of business because of this? It's a private entity, right (or at least a non-profit)? So if no one buys, or donates, to its product then it has fallen victim to market forces, just like that old Pizza-in-a-cup place. There is no guarantee for anyone for economic prosperity.
Secondly, why exactly should I give a fuck if AWARE must either teach things it doesn't agree with or stay out of schools? Kind of comes with the territory. Every teacher in America teaches things they agree 100% with?
Maybe AWARE could continue as an after school indoctrination center if it a) believes people will support it financially, and b) doesn’t want the mean old government telling it what to teach.
@9 - Willis is just in denial, like his God King in DC.
My God King in DC?
At least mine will actually run for President this year, while you sit on the sidelines pining for someone who won't run.
"“That’s like taking the speed limit, and seeing how far you can go above it, and still count it as not speeding.”"
ok when the fuck will people STOP using analogies. They oversimplify the issue and its NEVER THE FUCKING SAME THING!!!!
How much you wanna bet that clucking indignant 14-year-old girl you didn't get to interview is pregnant inside of two years? 48 hours after the braces come off...
Oh give her more credit than that Fnarf. She'll have mouth gonorrhea 48 hours after the braces come off.
Sorry, that was completely uncalled for.
For the pass several years major STI's such as Chlamydia and Gonorrhea have increased. Despite comprehensive sex ed in the vast majority of schools in King County we see that KC tops the charts in rates per 100,000.
This Bill is nothing more than a waste of time failing to address the real issues and look for real solutions to the problems. Instead of going after abstinence educators why not focus on our own damn curriculum and seeing why it isn't working.
This whole thing is a joke...as if abstinence educators such as AWARE and SHARE are the problem...give me a break. Just look at the STD morbidity rates for WA. and see...there is no evidence to suggest that the comp. sex ed. that we've been teaching our kids in WA. has been effective.
Just to clear things up...I think you all should know that we are not anti-teaching contraceptives, the fact of the matter is it is very important to have teenagers know about it if they so choose to be sexually active, but for teenagers who volunteer to speak to other teens about healthy relationships, they shouldnt have to also PROMOTE condom use as being okay as a teen ect. I believe that no one should be forced to advocate something they dont believe in. Teenagers should have the opertunity to choose or have the advantage of listening to both sides of sex education. However I acknowledg that people dont have the same believes that i do, but some people do so why not meet in the middle and have both groups come in and talk.....seperatly.....PROBLEM SOLVED!!!!!!
sorry organicrules @ 18, but your facts are dead wrong.
King County does not lead the state in rates per 100,000 in STDs.
The rate per 100,000 for chlamydia is nearly double in Adams County (first one I checked) and appears to be much higher in almost every county in eastern Washington.
Yes, King County had 5241 chlamydia cases last year, but Pierce County had 3031 cases -- the KC pop is almost 2.4 times larger.
For gonorrhea, again we lead the state in raw numbers (w/1937 cases in 2006), but tiny little Cowlitz County had 222, which works out to rate 2.11 times higher than ours.
Yes, 81% of the state's syphillis cases in 2006 were from KC (we're 28% of the state pop) and we are the undisputed leader here. But virtually all cases are in older adults (not teens or newly sexual folks).
There is no comprehensive sex ed in huge parts of Washington state and never has been. And if you look at STD and accidental pregnancy rates in the rural areas you'll see proof of the harm it does.
How about you all get a sense of class and forego the slander. Furthermore, Your arguments are generally unconcerned with the actual issue. Lets get away from supercilious comments about God, or derogatory, unbased statements about a 14 year old girl. The real issue at hand is whether or not schools should be forced to include comprehensive sex-ed in thier curriculum. In my opinion, AWARE should not be forced to advocate abstinence on one hand and then on the other tell them about the benefits of condoms. These two equally informative groups should stay separate to drive the point of abstinence while also teaching them about other alternatives to help prevent STD's and pregnancy.
Uhhh Gnossos
I said King County tops the charts...not that it leads.
I started a new thread in the Forums under Slog called Comp. Sex Ed., Abstinence and HB 1297...I will post my response to your comments there.
peace
unpartisan @ 21:
"These two equally informative groups should stay separate to drive the point of abstinence while also teaching them about other alternatives to help prevent STD's and pregnancy."
Oh batcrap. Sorry, that's like saying we should teach intelligent design.
They are not equally informative.
Abstinence education is a religiously driven movement and has absolutely no place being publicly funded or supported -- whether in schools, in AIDS prevention programs, or anywhere else.
sorry Organicrules...having trouble parsing how tops the charts differs from leads...see you in forums.
Anyone interested in furthering this discussion there is a thread in the Forums...http://forums.thestranger.com/showthread.php?t=6256 In case this link doesn't work the thread is under Forums...Slog...then 'Comp. Sex Ed., Abstinence and HB1297'
The two groups definetly need distinction. You cannot preach the benefits of abstinence while also teaching them how to use a condom, it condones the sexual activites of these minors. While it is true, that students need the knowledge given to them by PP, you cannot effectively advocate abstinence while condoning sex.
Although there is a large percentage of the abstinence movement that is religously motivated, the benefits of abstinence are undisputed. They are not preaching in the classroom, rather they inform the students to the risk of premarital sex, and the complications involved.
I'm the pro-comprehensive Sex Education teen that testified yesterday. And to be completely honest, those abstinence christian kids really irritated me. I'm a member of a peer educating group from Planned Parenthood called Teen Council, so basically the opposite of AWARE. AWARE would not be"put out of buisness" if this bill passes. It just means when they are invited to a school,groups like Teen Council will be too. I don't know why they are concerned, they should feel confident with their message and hope it is spread to teens regardless of the bill.
As far as abstinence education, like I said it is really great. But the things taught in comprehensive sex education are life lessons. How will we be able to enter a marriage without knowing anything about birth control? And as far as STD's and HIV/AIDS, there are a lot of situations where an individual contracts a disease inside his or her marriage.
As far as PP or Teen Council advocating watching porn as a form of abstinence, I have never witnessed that in classrooms during presentations or anywhere else.
Abstinence education should follow alongside comprehensive sex education. Abstinence is a birth control method as well as a way to protect yourself against STDS. It is defined differently for each individual.
I really don't understand how teens can oppose recieving medically accurate information about sex. It's just the facts, and teens can make their own decisions based on their own values and lifestyles.
Thanks for all the support for the bill!
Well first of all you are somewhat assuming that every individual that is part of aware is a christian. Within our presentation there is no mention of christian values. You made that assumtion. Also you are getting the information that we are worried about the business going down from a journalist who can write whatever he wants. Within our presentation we talk about STD's a fair amount of the time and say that if you are sexually active you need to go get checked on a regular basis. I also believe that comprehensive sex education should be taught but entirely seperate from our presentation. The two do not go together. It is like giving all this information the whole time and at the end completely contradicting it. Also,if schools are not wanting planned parenthood to come into the schools and are choosing for AWARE to come in, don't you think that is saying something about what the people actually want. Like I said, I believe as well that kids need information, in fact the staff a part of aware feels that way. The only thing we are fighting for is that we do not have to include comprehensive sex education within our presentation and that you guys do your thing seperately. We talk about abstinence, you talk about condoms. What has been the problem with that in the first place? The reason you guys are upset is because people are not all wanting you to come into the school along with abstinence programs. So now the state is trying to force it when some people don't want it.
I'm a teacher and I use Planned Parenthood's "Making Sense of Abstinence" with my students.
The observation that it promotes pornography is absolutely inaccurate. The manual acknowledges that there are MANY things that a person might abstain from, and that abstinence users need to have a grasp on what exactly they are deciding to abstain from in order to be successful with their decisions.
The only specific reference to "porn" in the entire manual comes in an activity in which a variety of sexual/interpersonal activities are mentioned (among them masturbation, holding hands, kissing, intercourse, oral sex, and watching porn videos, etc.) and students first decide on their own which THEY think an "abstinent" person can do.
Then they pair up with another student and compare notes, discovering that their defenitions of "abstinence" likely don't match up. Then they pair up with more students, and the confusion and differences about the word are further exposed. Seeing so many differenes in how "abstinence" is defined, ultimately leads to the discovery that one really needs to apply personal meaning to "abstinence" in order for it to mean anything. (And that teacher's use of "just say no" or "be abstinent until you're married" doesn't mean ANYTHING if it does not include a discussion of WHAT one might say no to!)
For anyone to distort this activity as Planned Parenthood promoting porn videos is to miss the entire essense and pedagogical importance of the lesson.
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