Slog - Comments on Oliver Stone's 9/11 Conspiracy Theory http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co I deplore World Trade Center. It's a hack job of the grossest order: trite (if you or your significant other were buried under 20 feet of rubble, would you drift off into pillow-soft-focus reveries about sawing wood with your son?), boring (two people immobilized under 20 feet of rubble does not make for an interesting hour of cinema), and infuriating (in the way the film recklessly links 9/11 and the Iraq war). From my review: The two cops are eventually rescued by a rogue marine named Dave Karnes. Karnes isn't just any first responder—in fact, he's retired from the service.... Copyright 2007 Thu, 10 Aug 2006 12:12:02 -0800 Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:32:26 -0800 http://www.movabletype.org/?v=3.34 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Comment by Lloyd Clydesdale It's disaster romanticized. Just in case you would remember it somehow else.

]]> Lloyd Clydesdale http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444781 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444781 Arts Thu, 10 Aug 2006 12:55:43 -0800 Comment by SeMe Annie,I enjoyed your review of this film, and I share your concern that it is careless when it makes an Iraq-9/11 connection at the end. Oliver Stone would probably answer with this quote from his La WEEKLY interview: "This is a populist film. We’ve said that from the beginning. In our hearts, it was a Frank Capra type of movie."

I think thats a bull shit statement, but Im stil not sure if Im going to skip this film or not.

The LA weekly has a good interview with Oliver Stone.

http://www.laweekly.com/general/features/after-the-fall/14187/

]]> SeMe http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444797 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444797 Arts Thu, 10 Aug 2006 13:16:48 -0800 Comment by Confused Umm, what's wrong with noting that one of the characters served in Iraq? Since when does Oliver Stone have an obligation to make sure that in no way could anybody associate 9/11 with war in Iraq?

]]> Confused http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444888 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444888 Arts Thu, 10 Aug 2006 14:55:11 -0800 Comment by Defused Haven't seen it, of course, but I also don't quite understand the outrage over the 9/11-Iraq connection as its been described.

It sounds to me like the character expresses a desire for revenge, as many did at that time. It might have been wrong, but it happened.

Then in the end, they say what the characters did after the events of the film, as nearly every real-people-based film does. Wouldn't leaving out that the character went to Iraq have been an even more political move? Thousands and thousands of soldiers went to Iraq with the idea that they were getting revenge for 9/11. They were wrong, of course, but they still went.

]]> Defused http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444960 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c444960 Arts Thu, 10 Aug 2006 16:11:48 -0800 Comment by Bullshit sells Did the main character go on to rape women and kill things? Did God tell him to do that too?

]]> Bullshit sells http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445010 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445010 Arts Thu, 10 Aug 2006 17:20:16 -0800 Comment by THE DOGS MAY BARK I saw "World Trade Center" in preview a week ago and found it sufficiently dramatic and reasonably satisfying in its ending - that surviving is a good thing no matter what. But I wondered: how will the contentious truculents like Michael Medved, Laura Ingraham, Michael Savage, Rush and Bill be able to trash their favorite bete noire, Oliver Stone? Since the movie is basically apolitical, will they actually review the movie based on its narrative merits? Now it's clear we don't have to wait on those folk at all because the left can trash Oliver just as well as the right. See the movie, folks - draw you own conclusions; think for yourself while you still have that right. Jeeze, if you let The Stranger tell you what movie to see, next they'll be telling you how to vote.

]]> THE DOGS MAY BARK http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445043 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445043 Arts Thu, 10 Aug 2006 18:51:55 -0800 Comment by annie There's nothing necessarily wrong with noting that a character served in Iraq. However, when someone writes a script that puts words into a character's mouth (if you read the Slate article I linked to, you'll see that the real Dave Karnes did not cooperate with the filmmakers), and the very last thing that character says is that he intends to "avenge" 9/11; and the very last thing that you the viewer see before the credits is that he went on to serve in Iraq, then the connection has been drawn for you. If you do, indeed, see the film, I think you will see that the false link was not made inadvertently.

]]> annie http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445230 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445230 Arts Fri, 11 Aug 2006 11:28:20 -0800 Comment by THE DOGS MAY BARK Links between WTC and Iraq?? Let's see sometime after 9/11, wasn't there an incident where one country invaded another country that probably wouldn't have happened had not 9/11 happened. Linkage? nah - just weird happenstance.
Just because a "connection has been drawn for you" - must you accept it? Sometimes movies are just movies. It seems to me that most movie-makers blithely ignore Samuel Goldwyn's maxim: "If you want to send a message, use Western Union." But the post-apocalyptic generation has no idea what Western Union is. Oops.

]]> THE DOGS MAY BARK http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445246 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445246 Arts Fri, 11 Aug 2006 11:50:18 -0800 Comment by Tracey Waters Apparantly Ann Wagner did see the same movie I did.
There was no tying 9/11 to Iraq in the movie. Only the subscript that David Karnes was a real player by mentioning he re-enlisted and subsequently served two tours in Iraq. I don't see that as an im;ication of anything -just the facts. Also there is not a single implication that he is at church during the pentacost. But that he is there prayng for direction at a time of national duress. Only someone blinded by ideology could have come to the same conclusions as wagner.

]]> Tracey Waters http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445628 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c445628 Arts Sat, 12 Aug 2006 05:48:27 -0800 Comment by Rick I saw the movie and I have worked with Dave Karnes. The dramatic character seemed close to the mark. I think a ton of people are missing the point here. Regardles of what you make of what Hollywood has portrayed as Dave's faith or political comentary he put himself in the right place at the right time. It is admirable that he was able to come to the aid of McLaughlin and Jimenez. Two families remain intact due to his efforts.

]]> Rick http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c446545 http://slog.thestranger.com/2006/08/oliver_stones_911_co#c446545 Arts Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:32:26 -0800