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Wednesday, January 4, 2006

Bars are Not Dog Parks

Posted by on January 4 at 10:51 AM

Two out of the last three bars I’ve gone toThe Canterbury and the Cha-Chahave allowed pet dogs in. This looks like a violation of King County Code Chapter 8.40.190, Seattle Municipal Code 10.10.536, and King County Board of Health Code 6.501.115.

When I go out to a bar, I want to relax. Dogs make me anxious. When I hear the constant jingling of your dog’s collar right behind me, I’m stuck waiting for the dog to scamper over and sniff around my food and tablewhich, in fact, your dog did (twice) last night when I was there trying to chill out after work and read a book at the Canterbury on Capitol Hill.

Your table thinks your dog is cute. So does the waitress. So, I become the bad guy when I have to “rudely” tell you that “I’m not cool, with your dog coming over to my table.” I told you that, yet your dog raced over, collar jangling, the second some food arrived at my table. (Thus, my anxiety about it wasn’t misplaced.)

I don’t think your dog is cute. And even if some people do think your dog is cute, I don’t care. It’s not allowed in bars and restaurants.

This isn’t a question of who can and cannot control their dogsor keeping your dog on a leash. No dogs are allowed in, unless it is a guide dog accompanying a blind person.

If you’re not blind, and you want to go out to a bar or restaurant, you have to leave your dog at homeor with a friend. If you can’t find someone to watch your dog, then you can’t go out to a bar or restaurant.


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The same post could be made if you changed "dog" for "baby." But people still don't get that message. Remember the single whore who went to the strip club? Although, I would rather the dog be in the bar than in a car with the windows up. Hey, at least the dog won't get lung cancer from second-hand smoke...

I wish babies were illegal.

I think the dog owners are secretly french.

What is this, fucking Thunderdome? Is anything off limits?

Fuck yo' dog!

/figure of speach

You are such a fucking scolds. I thought the Stranger was the less rules not more rules paper. Why are you 80 year olds going to bars anyway? Aren't you worried about breaking a hip? You don't like smoking? Dogs make you nervous? I suggest stay home and watch Golden Girls. I'm looking forward to the "Music is too loud post."

The problem isn't the presence of dogs, necessarily, but rather that the owners don't prevent them from storming your table and begging for food incessantly. And of course, the inevitable dog fight between two males that will send patrons fleeing at some point during the evening.

"He's not usually aggressive."

Bad dog? No, bad owner.

Dogs are scum.

While I am suspicious of people who don't like dogs, I mostly agree with Josh -- because people suck and don't care for their dogs properly.
I will clarify one thing, however, service dogs don't have to be just for blind people. They can accompany people in wheelchairs, with hearing disabilities, and with other types of developmental disabilities, as long as they are licensed to do so.

As Sheila Anderson alludes to, in every bar or restaurant in France, at least in Paris, you'll see people with dogs.

However, those dogs are ALWAYS curled up and utterly quiet under their owner's table. ALWAYS. It would be no more acceptable for a dog to come over to your table than it would for the owner to take a shit on your silverware.


Which is how it should be here. But unfortunately Seattle dog owners are for the most part complete dunderheads with no idea of what "training" means. I love dogs, but I am sick, sick, sick of idiots whose dogs bark, jump up, snarl, fight, bite, and crap everywhere without restraint.

It's just thoughtless and rude. It doesn't make me a "scold" to dislike it. You're stepping on other people. If you want your dog to run free with no restraints, move to the woods with your hippie friends.

You fucking baby. STAY HOME. Jesus.

France? What about Mexico where there are dogs in bars all over the place and people seem to take extra joy in kicking the shit out of 'em.

I've got an idea Josh, since you and the rest of the team have become such baby scolds, why don't you stay the hell home and let the rest of us deal with the real world?

"dogs make me anxious" -- are you kidding me?

I agree with the post, leave the pooches at home as a common courtesy to your fellow patron (common courtesy in America? In Seattle? Well, those of us who routinely remember to say please and thank you to everyone (whether they deserve it or not) can “dream the Dream”)

If the restaurant wants to accept the possible health code violation, the managers/owners should at least enforce the leash law (public v private space argument be damned. And of course your dog is well behaved and is a credit to its breed/species; I am talking about everyone else, of course. Thanks Mom and Dad, the “Me Generation” has won.)

But hey, we can dream that maybe the Joint Task force will start including animal control officers in their enforcement patrol. And maybe the health inspectors will start issuing fines to the owners of the dogs and the restaurants.

A dog around food is gross, that is why the health law was put into affect way back when. Gee… a law that protects second and third party folks from possibly health harming individuals? Who would have thought?
.

"dogs make me anxious" -- are you kidding me?

Well, I'm with Josh on this, except dogs don't just make me anxious, they make me very, very afraid. Yes. I have a fear of dogs. I have no problem with dogs that stay the hell away from me but I have NEVER, in this city, encountered a respectful dog owner. I'm not saying they don't exist, I'm just saying that in my experience, dog owners in this city don't give a shit about how their dogs make other people feel and allow them to jump on, lick and hump strangers even AFTER being politely asked to keep the dog away.

Let me add my voice to those supporting Josh's view here.

And to those who think Josh needs to face the real world, I submit that those pet owners so self-absorbed that they can't handle being without their dog long enuf to get dinner are the ones who need to face the real world, the one that's affected by their actions for good or for ill.

Amen. As we used to say in "The Movement" Lostboy: Make it Plain!

I've always felt that (many) dog owners and (many) smokers were of a kind. They impose on others, and then flip the fuck out when you ask them to knock it off.

It's fine to have a dog, to be out and about. But you do have to keep your dog under control—off Josh's food, away from kids, noses well out of stranger's crotches. If you can't do that, you're an asshole—not your dog, you.

One of the reasons dogs are banned in many public places, and leash laws are imposed, is because a significant minority of dog owners can't be trusted to keep their dogs under control. So all dogs are leashed, kept out of public places, etc.—including mine.

Dogs shouldn't be allowed in public spaces any closer than 25 feet of the door of public spaces. Second hand allergies affect some people terribly. It's up to a good society to protect it's citizens and maintain public spaces so that they are available to everyone.

And, yes, I'm joking.

Find someone with an MD to declare that you are depressed, get the dog prescribed to help you with your depression then you've got a service animal.

Josh: please toss a few fries on the floor for the service animal. Thanks.

but seriously...

I'm with Dan. Don't be an asshole.

I'm with Dan on this twist to the golden rule: Don't be an asshole.

And yes B.D., that means you too.

How many of life's difficulties would be eased if those four words were taken to heart.

Too bad so many people in this city and elsewhere think being an asshole is a way to be free.

Unless they are helper dogs the establishment should restrict them. People will get away with all the crap they can until someone tells them ‘no’.

Oh yeah….And folks who bring dogs onto public transit. I hate that. Of course, helper dogs are one thing…they are ok…they are trained to behave. I hate the pricks that bring their regular unruly pet dogs onto the crowded buses and then are jerks when the dogs go nutz. The bus drivers are really the jerks though. They let them on…but I was on the bus one time where one driver said ‘no’ to an obviously regular pet dog and the dog’s owner threatened lawsuit cause there was no way to pin down what ‘helper dog’ actually meant--like arguing over what the definition of ‘is’ is.

Yeah, most dog owners are like people who can’t control their kids. You see them all the time on Judge Judy…You know, their dog killed the neighbor’s cat and attacked their kid. But, the Dog owner says it’s everybody else’s fault they don’t lock their pets and children up…Because they can’t be expected to corral their pit bull.


Just to set the record straight, I would like to point out that, as the person sitting WITH josh at the table where this contentious dog was sniffing around, I - not Mr. Feit - was the one who spoke up and told a table of very annoyed dog-lovers that I "wasn't cool" with their dog rooting around the table.

which I'm not. just because you love your dog, that doesn't mean I have to. right on, Josh.

Ben,
Scold? 80 years old?
I went to the Canterbury to read—where they have Metallica on the juke box—because I like loud bars where people are out and about and loud music is playing.

What I don't like is: dogs up in my face.

I'm not the misanthrope here. The people who can't go to a bar without leaving their dogs at home are the misanthropes.

It's also totally gross to have animals trotting around at a place where food is served. (It's also illegal!)

I like going out. And I'm going to continue to do so. I'm just not going to go to the Canterbury anymore.

And it's true: It was ECB who told the dog owners that, "we weren't cool with their dog coming over to our table." Right on, ECB.

I can't believe this is even a topic of discussion.

Anyone who has a problem with getting hit in the kisser when their dog sniffs my crotch might want to stop being so uptight or just stay the fuck home and watch the golden girls.

I love my dog. He's my buddy, my baby, and he keeps himself within two feet of me at all times just in case he's gonna get some pettin'. He's a great, loyal, well-trained and laid-back dog.


I also keep him the fuck away from strangers unless he's invited, because he will forget all his training in his excitement, jump for joy and get mud on them, lick their faces, or otherwise defile them in ways many people are strongly opposed to.


And given his ongoing smell (which I love because he's my dog and it's his smell) and the damage he does to my car just by being in it, he's never, ever, under any circumstances, allowed in a place of business that doesn't include the word "veterinarian". Okay, Petco excluded from that because they invite him in.


Since when did self-policing yourself place you in line with "scolds"? Are adults such a rare breed in Seattle that asking people to obey the fucking law and respect other people is somehow an affront to freedom and decency? Josh is right, and you douches who want to bring your dog everywhere you go need to seriously talk to someone about your abandonment issues.

Dogs can blow me--and they often do. That's my main beef with 'em. They don't wait till I take off my trousers.

People like Switzerblog make this world a better place.

And I thought that I was just being snarky. But if you believe I was being an asshole, then I can live with it.

Listen, I agree with Dan and Josh that I wouldn't appreciate going to some place and having a dog interfere with my meal. Once is probably fine, but after I make my intentions clear, then the owner should respect my wishes. Barring that, then the establishment should respect my wishes.

However, if the establishment chooses to let dogs in and chooses to ignore my wishes, then I'll take my business elsewhere. It was the same view I take with smoking.

For the record, I don't smoke (never have) nor do I currently own a dog (have in the past). Oh, and I don't particularly care for dogs being carried into clothing shops either.

The bigger question:




Why do people read go to a bar or restaurant to read when they are trying to "chill out?"




F-ing hipster. Yes, you look cool there with your book. It's quieter in your apartment. Also looking up the city ordinances and posting them in bold on this site is quite lame. Just tell us there is an ordinance.




Oh, I hope Neil from the Up Series is doing well.

Mark,

If it pisses you off that I felt like reading in a neighborhood bar, and it pisses you off that I cited some ordinances, you're a complete basket case.

so josh, is it okay to have dogs in taverns that do not serve food? i'm thinking of a couple that seem to abide by this policy.

also, you are allowed to have non-service pets on metro buses. their policy is here. you have to pay a separate fare if your animal is large.

switzerblog is good.

i am with josh, dogs do not belong in bars. as a part-time bartender, i can say that the only thing worse than a dog running around the bar is a drunk puking in the corner.

yeah, there are good dog owners that keep their animals under the table but,sadly, they seem to be few and far between at drinking establishments.

whilst tending bar, i have had these things happen:


- a dog bit a customer and said customer ended up with 4 stitches

- a dog shit on the floor and the owner ignored it

- a dog fight (in the fucking bar!)

as for reading in bars: jesus christ! let josh read wherever he wants to read. dude likes to drink and read at the same time. last time i checked, THAT hasn't been banned. yet.

Annie: The county and city ordinances I listed were about prohibiting dogs from being in places that serve food. I'll have to double check on the Board of Health one.

I've got no problem with dogs on buses.

I'm not into having a dog around while I'm sipping a beer, but if there's no law against dogs in taverns, I'm not going to raise a fuss. I'm happy to leave a tavern if Fido is trotting around—and find a bar where it's supposedly illegal for Fido to hang out. (And yes, Mark, don't have an aneurysm, I might even have a book with me while I'm getting out of the apartment for a few hours in the evening.)

For those people who can't bear to leave their dogs at home when they go out to a bar, and want to protest this unjust law, they've got my blessing to dash off their own "Letter from a Birmingham Jail" about how the no-dogs-in-bars law is oppressing them.

I was at Pierre Ford today waiting to get my gas hog serviced and also in the waiting room was this UNLEASHED mongrel dog. Actually he looked like a real people dog, but that's not the point. He was a lab mix of some kind. And he had to sniff everyone all over. Multiple times. My shoes, my pants, my ipod. The owner could have at least had him on a leash.

About people reading in bars. I like to take a book, grab a glass of wine, and sit quietly in the corner of my neighborhood watering hole. Not because I'm a "hipster", but because if I stay home and read in my quiet apartment, I will fall asleep, quickly. I need noise and distraction in order to focus more on what I am reading, and stay awake for that matter. Please don't judge us public readers, it's just how we work.

I love public readers. More people should follow their example.

dog owners are complete assholes for the most part- the worst thing is the thousands of kids their damn dogs chew up every year- have a dog asshole- go ahead, but do not bother other people with it or allow it to put others at risk.

You have every right to live in dog shit if you want too- just don't subject quiet decent people to your dog crap..

Make damn sure it does not kill or maul some child or old person and keep your fucking dog quiet at night - I have to work- even if you don't dog breath...

Dog noise pollution is at mind numbing levels in Santa Barbara where I live.

People are getting very tired of dog owner's selfish mean spirited attitudes-

try real hard and get a human friend....

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